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Rincewind

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What a fight between Whittaker and Brunson in last nights main event, and what a finish!!! Brunson came for a fight and thats what he got.

Fight of the Night and Performance of the night bonuses earned by Whittaker. 5-0 now at MW and second longest win streak in the division. He gets better every fight. Prime example of a fighter finding success after moving up weight class. Can see him possibly being matched up with Weidman next time out.

Card on the whole was very good. Australian events are usually pretty sterile on paper but are always entertaining in fairness. Anyone else watch it?
 
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underdog140

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Could you confirm which country and the grade (ie: high school/Collegiate/other) you are specifically referring to when you say there are sometimes weigh ins the night before? Most rule sets I know of are very very strict when it comes to weigh ins. In extreme cases they dont even allow practice areas to be hotter than a certain temp in case competitors are sneakily cutting weight while they are waiting to weigh in. Could you also just perhaps let me know the kind of weight you personally cut to partake in a wrestling match/tournamet, that you believe gives you reasonable insight into how difficult weight cutting really is?

Due to the same day weigh ins, weight cuts in wrestling are very rarely more than 3-4 pounds on the morning of the weigh in. This is nothing in comparison to the likes of MMA or Boxing where the average fighter would be cutting 10-12 pounds and quite often up to 20 pounds even for the smaller weight classes. 3-4 pounds for a wrestler would take most people an hour or so in a sweatsuit on a bike or treadmill whereas the MMA fighter takes about 24-36 hours to lose 10-12 pounds. I actuall feel a little silly explaining this because you should already know it. If you did actually compete in the sport.


There is no comparison. No offence but the kind of weight cutting that goes on in (most) wrestling is a walk in the park. The only remotely difficult part of it is the frequency they tend to do it at. Weekly in some cases but its no more difficult than a hard cardio session the morning of a match/tournament.

I am sorry but you are just wrong about some of this stuff. Some other stuff may be true and other stuff spot on. The rules are likely slightly different depending on were the tournaments are. For instance the 3-4 lbs thing is just completely off. The weight cutting is no walk in the park.

I don't want to give out too much personal info on here. I will PM you I guess.

I will also like to know what do you train in and what have you competed in that gives you this insight you think is so much greater then mine.

Yawn. Ad hominem at its finest.

Let's not pretend I'm not right. Learn from your mistake and move forward.

Aldo is a paper champion until he at least fights the winner of Holloway/Pettis. Simple as.

You can have that opinion if you like. But I have the one of, he already earned the belt in the Edgar fight. Nothing Aldo can do about Conor moving onto another division.

Dont need to make any video. Conor's singular achievements in and out of the Octagon speak for themselves whether you think he deserves them or not.

Well that is disappointing ... I was looking forward to seeing it.

The truth is I am just having a little fun with some of this stuff and started needling you a little bit once I seen you got upset and started calling me sweetheart and telling me to "blow all your begrudgery out your arse".

It is obvious we are not going to agree on this Conor situation. You are a very big fan of his and I am not going to convince you of the situation as I see it. I am not a big fan of his and despite what you may think I am not a hater of his either. Just calling things as I see him. So lets move on as to not clutter this thread with the same discussion every page.
 
Rincewind

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I am sorry but you are just wrong about some of this stuff. Some other stuff may be true and other stuff spot on. The rules are likely slightly different depending on were the tournaments are. For instance the 3-4 lbs thing is just completely off. The weight cutting is no walk in the park.

Whats completely off about it? I could easily drop 4lbs in a couple of hours. Actually I know for a fact I weighed 180 before I went to bed last night and woke up weighing 179. I went for a long slow run this afternoon and weighed 177 after it. Thats 2 pounds i dropped in an hour and a half with out even trying. And before you ask, I weigh myself about 6 times a day depending on how many times I train.

At most levels, weight cutting for wrestling is a lot easier than cutting weight for a day before weigh in like you have in most MMA fights.



I don't want to give out too much personal info on here. I will PM you I guess.

PM received and answered but to be honest it doesn't really answer much that I asked you. In fact, just leaves me with more questions.

I will also like to know what do you train in and what have you competed in that gives you this insight you think is so much greater then mine.

2 amateur MMA fights and 3 Pro MMA fights in 5 year period between 2006 and 2010. Although my sherdog record on shows 1 amateur fight and 1 pro fight, Both of which were losses. :(

1 of the amateur fights was same day weigh in but the other and the three pro fights were all 24 hours before. When I was training I dieted down from 190 to about 180/182 and cut from there down to 170. Getting from 175 to 170 was horrible. I would say my absolute limit would have been 165.

These days I weigh quite a bit less than I did then. I walk around at about 180 now because I run a lot now and dont train MMA anymore, except for BJJ once or twice a week for fun and for LME because I hate gyms.

I've also done (and still do sometimes) more cuts than I can remember with teammates and friends, as in helped them through it.

I'm not an expert but I do have first hand experience of cutting weight and I do know more about it than 99.9% of people out there.



Let's not pretend I'm not right. Learn from your mistake and move forward.

Probably the most arrogant thing I have read from you.



You can have that opinion if you like. But I have the one of, he already earned the belt in the Edgar fight. Nothing Aldo can do about Conor moving onto another division.

Paper Champion until he beats someone for the undisputed title.



Well that is disappointing ... I was looking forward to seeing it.

The truth is I am just having a little fun with some of this stuff and started needling you a little bit once I seen you got upset and started calling me sweetheart and telling me to "blow all your begrudgery out your arse".

It is obvious we are not going to agree on this Conor situation. You are a very big fan of his and I am not going to convince you of the situation as I see it. I am not a big fan of his and despite what you may think I am not a hater of his either. Just calling things as I see him. So lets move on as to not clutter this thread with the same discussion every page.

LOL if you think you would ever be capable of upsetting or needling me, you must be having a laugh!!

I am absolutely not the kind of person that lets internet chit chat upset him even in the slightest.
 
andyt5303

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Don't think there's any room for others to post in this thread with Underdog and Rincewind going at it all the time...

Think you two ought to get in the octagon and settle it yourselves haha!
 
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underdog140

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Whats completely off about it? I could easily drop 4lbs in a couple of hours. Actually I know for a fact I weighed 180 before I went to bed last night and woke up weighing 179. I went for a long slow run this afternoon and weighed 177 after it. Thats 2 pounds i dropped in an hour and a half with out even trying. And before you ask, I weigh myself about 6 times a day depending on how many times I train.

At most levels, weight cutting for wrestling is a lot easier than cutting weight for a day before weigh in like you have in most MMA fights.

Sure you can lose 4 lbs easily like that. But when you have already been keeping your weight down and been cutting weeks prior it is a different story. In short 4 lbs can be allot to lose if you already depleted your body leading up to that point.

PM received and answered but to be honest it doesn't really answer much that I asked you. In fact, just leaves me with more questions.

Reluctantly sent another.


2 amateur MMA fights and 3 Pro MMA fights in 5 year period between 2006 and 2010. Although my sherdog record on shows 1 amateur fight and 1 pro fight, Both of which were losses. :(

Nice, at least you got in there and gave it a shot.

Probably the most arrogant thing I have read from you.

Not arrogant at all. At least it wasn't meant to be.

LOL if you think you would ever be capable of upsetting or needling me, you must be having a laugh!!

I am absolutely not the kind of person that lets internet chit chat upset him even in the slightest.

If you say so. I think it is very obvious you got upset .. frustrated or what ever you want to call in in our debate. You said you weren't and only you truly know so lets move on regardless.


I didn't want to quote everything but I made similar cuts but at different weights. And in the past also helped others cut as well. By the sounds of it not as often as you have. I am surprised a person with your experience believes wrestlers cut 3/4 lbs on weigh in day while at the same time making the cut sound like a walk in the park. There are days / weeks of cutting leading up to that point.
 
Rincewind

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Sure you can lose 4 lbs easily like that. But when you have already been keeping your weight down and been cutting weeks prior it is a different story. In short 4 lbs can be allot to lose if you already depleted your body leading up to that point.

RE: The bolded bits. This is probably the most common misconception about weight cutting among those that have never done it or dont know what it is. Weight cutting doesn't happen over a few weeks. Your getting confused between cutting and dieting. Two TOTALLY different things, that have nearly no effect on each other.

In its simplest form dieting is getting rid of fat from the body. Cutting is temporarily getting rid of water. Dieting is done over a few weeks, cutting is done over a few hours. You said ''cutting for weeks prior''. Anybody that actually knows anything about cutting weight knows you cant do it for weeks.

And even after dieting for weeks, yes it would be relatively easy to lose 4lbs because its just water weight. I know. I've done it myself and seen it done many times. Its when you try to go beyond that, that it gets difficult. Personally, i dropped the first 4 or 5 pounds pretty easily. But once i started slowing down every ounce was a nightmare.

Main point being, you are mixing up dieting with cutting.



Reluctantly sent another.

Appreciate it, but to be honest, no less vague than the first one.




Nice, at least you got in there and gave it a shot.



Not arrogant at all. At least it wasn't meant to be.

When you say something like:

''Lets not pretend I'm not right''

Thats extremely arrogant.



If you say so. I think it is very obvious you got upset .. frustrated or what ever you want to call in in our debate. You said you weren't and only you truly know so lets move on regardless.

Dont know how you got to conclusion that I was upset and/or frusrated from thousands of miles away, based entirely on text on a screen!? Like I said, not the type of person that allows myself to be annoyed by an opinion on the Internet.


I didn't want to quote everything but I made similar cuts but at different weights. And in the past also helped others cut as well. By the sounds of it not as often as you have. I am surprised a person with your experience believes wrestlers cut 3/4 lbs on weigh in day while at the same time making the cut sound like a walk in the park. There are days / weeks of cutting leading up to that point.

Again, here you're mixing up cutting and dieting. Its the dieting that happens for the weeks before. Dieting, done correctly should put zero strain on the body and actually make the body stronger and the cut easier. Cutting only happens in the hours prior to the weigh in. Usually no more than 24 hours at a stretch. Cutting weight depletes the body horribly by comparison to dieting.

It would not be possible for someone to go through a full cut prior to a same day weigh in as they just would not have the time necessary to recover prior to competing. 3-4 pounds, maybe 5 at a push, would be the limit of what could be done on the morning of a same day weigh in. And while it is not easy on its own, by comparison to a full cut it is relatively easy. For the record this is me saying that it (3-4lbs) is not easy but is a hell of a lot easier than a full weight cut.
 
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underdog140

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RE: The bolded bits. This is probably the most common misconception about weight cutting among those that have never done it or dont know what it is. Weight cutting doesn't happen over a few weeks. Your getting confused between cutting and dieting. Two TOTALLY different things, that have nearly no effect on each other.

In its simplest form dieting is getting rid of fat from the body. Cutting is temporarily getting rid of water. Dieting is done over a few weeks, cutting is done over a few hours. You said ''cutting for weeks prior''. Anybody that actually knows anything about cutting weight knows you cant do it for weeks.

And even after dieting for weeks, yes it would be relatively easy to lose 4lbs because its just water weight. I know. I've done it myself and seen it done many times. Its when you try to go beyond that, that it gets difficult. Personally, i dropped the first 4 or 5 pounds pretty easily. But once i started slowing down every ounce was a nightmare.

Main point being, you are mixing up dieting with cutting.

I wasn't confusing dieting with cutting. We just have a different Idea of both and I mingled the two processes in my explanation.

Dieting = Cutting down on food... exercising... slowly losing weight in a healthy manner. The first lbs are easy to shed as you already mentioned in your first post about going for a jog and dropping a couple lbs.

Cutting = Barely eating anything .. very little liquid intake that leads to none of either.. exercising ... and taking what most would see as extreme measures to produce a sweat. This processes starts allot sooner then the day of and isn't a healthy way to be losing weight. Which is why it is easy to put back on a percentage of the weight in a very short period of time.


Appreciate it, but to be honest, no less vague than the first one.

Not sure what you are looking for then. I gave a reasonable amount of information I thought.

When you say something like:

''Lets not pretend I'm not right''

Thats extremely arrogant.

These were one of things I mention earlier of me needling you. And like any good needle there is some truth to it. You were doing what I was pointing out. I could have pointed it out in a different manner.





Dont know how you got to conclusion that I was upset and/or frusrated from thousands of miles away, based entirely on text on a screen!? Like I said, not the type of person that allows myself to be annoyed by an opinion on the Internet.

I already pointed out how ... your use of the word .. sweetheart for one. When in a debate and a person uses that word it is usually being used by someone in some sort of emotional manner. At least from my experience. Again I could be wrong but that is how it came off to me. In either case it doesn't matter.




Again, here you're mixing up cutting and dieting. Its the dieting that happens for the weeks before. Dieting, done correctly should put zero strain on the body and actually make the body stronger and the cut easier. Cutting only happens in the hours prior to the weigh in. Usually no more than 24 hours at a stretch. Cutting weight depletes the body horribly by comparison to dieting.

It would not be possible for someone to go through a full cut prior to a same day weigh in as they just would not have the time necessary to recover prior to competing. 3-4 pounds, maybe 5 at a push, would be the limit of what could be done on the morning of a same day weigh in. And while it is not easy on its own, by comparison to a full cut it is relatively easy. For the record this is me saying that it (3-4lbs) is not easy but is a hell of a lot easier than a full weight cut.

I already addressed the dieting / cutting so leaving that part out....

The day of or the day before, The cut can still be made. It is just allot easier for the athlete if weigh in is the day before. It is healthier to have more time to re-hydrate. So the day before is preferred.

I seen this argument before which I got reminded of after reading your post ... people wanting weigh ins for MMA changed to the day of to try and stop some of the weight cutting .. My thoughts on that were .. they will just have less time to put on the weight they cut but majority would still be fighting in the same weight class. So the only thing that changes is the risk the fighters are taking stepping into the cage because of the less time they have to re-hydrate.
 
johnny tigre

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I think we need to get Dana White to include underdog vs rincewind in the next UFC event.... hehehe Peace!!
 
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Supposedly there is a big announcement being made on Nov. 30th involving everyone below.

GSP
Cain
Tim Kennedy
Cerrone
TJ Dillashaw
Bjorn Rebney ( Former Bellator CEO )
 
OzExorcist

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Supposedly there is a big announcement being made on Nov. 30th involving everyone below.

GSP
Cain
Tim Kennedy
Cerrone
TJ Dillashaw
Bjorn Rebney ( Former Bellator CEO )

This almost certainly has to be about the formation of a fighter's union (or similar), right?
 
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This almost certainly has to be about the formation of a fighter's union (or similar), right?

Has to be ... no way it can another org with most those names under UFC contract ( It would be great if it was ) . Very interesting that Bjorn Rebney is one of the people on the list.

I can't think of anything else it might be.
 
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Way to much tattoo-ing in the UFC, why is that asks Playful and is there ever enuff lol
 
OzExorcist

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Very interesting that Bjorn Rebney is one of the people on the list.

Yeah, that name stuck right out to me too, and it's come out of left field - if this is a unionisation thing AFAIK this is the first time his name has come up in any kind of relation to it. Guys like Kennedy and Cerrone on the other hand have been pretty vocal on the issue.

It makes a certain kind of sense though I guess. He has knowledge of how the organisations run, and he ran probably the most "proper sport" version of the sport maybe ever (for better or worse).
 
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The UFC is Changing.

Another rumor going around that the UFC is looking to secure a more lucrative TV Deal. A deal that involves getting rid of Joe Rogan and Mike Goldberg.

The front runner for replacing Rogan is Mario Lopez. It gets better ....

A second rumor of Ryan Seacrest for backstage interviews is also going around.

http://smackhisface.com/2016/11/30/...ew-owners-to-introduce-new-broadcasting-team/

There was talks of Rogan leaving soon on his own anyways But I always thought they would give the job to someone who fought for the company.
 
andyt5303

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I've said in the past about Joe Rogan leaving not being a huge deal when they have guys like DC, Cruz, Stann and Dan Hardy in their ranks. I think these are all very good commentators for the UFC who wouldnt have any trouble replacing Rogan. Particularly Dan Hardy after watching a few of his 'Inside the Octagon' previews on YouTube - he's one of the best at breaking down fights imo.

But to bring in guys like Ryan f**king Seacrest and that guy from saved by the bell?! cmonnnnnnnn
 
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The meeting is taking place .... live updates here ... https://twitter.com/bloodyelbow

Tim Kennedy: "I'm proud to announce the official launch of the Mixed Martial Arts Athlete Association."

"We're here to never leave someone behind. The one sided system that the UFC has in place will be changed immediately"

Georges St Pierre now talking. Says that he may be viewed as a villain for bringing these issues up, but he wants change

GSP says that in most sports the money is 50/50 for athletes. In MMA it's 8%.

Georges St Pierre says that even Conor McGregor isn't getting his fair share

Bjorn called the UFC business plan outrageous. Fighters get paid pennies.

Edit: Wanted to add the below before it gets lost in new updates

Bjorn on his history as a promoter: The most successful year I ever had as a promoter, I paid my athletes 53% of our revenue.
 
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Bjorn: No we are not forming a union, we are an association.

Bjorn also says that they are focused on the UFC and not other promotions and that they are not a union. According to Kennedy Bjorn is on the team/association as an adviser and the board members are .. GSP, Cerrone, Cain, TJ and himself.
 
Poker Orifice

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Reading comprehension skills:

[ ] Rincewind

[ x ] underdog140



Arrogant

[ x ] Rincewind

[ ] underdog140


Really arrogant & obnoxious

[ x ] Rincewind

[ ] underdog140




My thoughts on a decent future UFC match....
Ronda Rousey vs. Dana White
 
OzExorcist

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Another rumor going around that the UFC is looking to secure a more lucrative TV Deal. A deal that involves getting rid of Joe Rogan and Mike Goldberg.

FWIW the bit about them looking to secure a more lucrative TV deal isn't a rumor, and it was always going to be the case when the current deal expires - whether Zuffa or WME were still in control. I think I was reading somewhere UFC content is the best-rating thing FS1 has, so it makes sense.

As for getting rid of Mike Goldberg OMG that can't happen soon enough :p

We might've even gotten rid of him sooner if he didn't suck so bad at calling football games.
 
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Yeah, I could have worded that better.

I would like to see them both stay but agree with Andyt5303 .. lets replace them with former fighters when the time comes.
 
OzExorcist

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What'll be interesting if the commentator rumours prove true is who gets to make the call, WME or the new TV rights holder.

Because another rumour flying around at the moment (and one I think sounds very plausible) is that WME wants to outsource all of the TV production process to the new rights holders (the UFC currently does its own TV production). That obviously moves a whole lot of the costs back off the UFC and onto the broadcaster... but if they're taking on that cost, will they then let the UFC dictate how they spend that money in terms of on-screen etc.?

Fox has shown a strong preference for fighters in its on-screen analyst roles to date.

I'm also not sure how effective "looking for hollywood talent to sit at the booth and help boost ratings and give the UFC a step up in the entertainment world" really is, especially when they're talking about D-grade talent like the names mentioned.

I mean did WME buy the UFC just so it had somewhere to use the crappy talent it already had on its books? Seems unlikely to me. Would make more sense to use it to develop in-house talent that they can then also book elsewhere...
 
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IMO it would be better to go with having a guest celeb on for a portion of the broadcast instead of giving them a full time job. They would get best of both worlds that way.
 
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According to Dana ... Cyborg was offered a fight for a 145 LB title not once but twice and turned it down.

First one was against Holly Holm for an inaugural 145 pound Championship but turned it down because she wasn't giving enough time to prepare.

Second was to fight Germaine on the upcoming Brooklyn card, for an inaugural 145 pound title, and Cyborg turned that down also.

Via UFC Unfiltered.
 
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Cyborg was given 8 weeks notice for the Holly Holm title fight.
 
WVHillbilly

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That makes sense what if she's still juiced up and knew she would fail a drug test? I mean she should be subject to random testing now so even that seems unlikely. Can't figure that one out.
 
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