Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
What, by imagining a conversation that will probably never happen? I suppose if you try hard enough you can imagine anything. LOL
How about he asks Dana for a title shot? By your logic that could just as easily happen if all it takes is Dana to give the go ahead.
SMD Jabroni
Rock Star
Silver Level
sorry. i thought i remembered the boys in the house doing challenges and stuff more than once a season.
I think all this TUF talk is because it is the only logical step punk can take.
you really gonna give him another shot on the main card ppv?
that mickey gall matchup was the best case scenario for an opponent.
there is literally no one less qualified.
and do you think dana white will really throw away money and let punk go fight somewhere else?
where does that leave punk? and how does dana make the most money out of the guy he is paying a lot of money to?
i get what you are saying that it doesn't make sense for him to go on TUF now.
but it didn't make sense he got a main card ppv fight in the first place.
and it makes even less sense if he gets another ufc fight.
so who knows.
I think all this TUF talk is because it is the only logical step punk can take.
you really gonna give him another shot on the main card ppv?
that mickey gall matchup was the best case scenario for an opponent.
there is literally no one less qualified.
and do you think dana white will really throw away money and let punk go fight somewhere else?
where does that leave punk? and how does dana make the most money out of the guy he is paying a lot of money to?
i get what you are saying that it doesn't make sense for him to go on TUF now.
but it didn't make sense he got a main card ppv fight in the first place.
and it makes even less sense if he gets another ufc fight.
so who knows.
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
What would actually make some little sense for Punk in the UFC would be if they could cultivate some sort of a feud with Mike Jackson and get them both to fight.
Two guys with little or no MMA experience and both have a 0-1 pro record.
Jackson already fired off a fairly mean/funny tweet at Punk right after his fight last weekend.
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underdog140
Legend
Silver Level
Well if something never happened yet ... our imagination is all we have isn't it.
My logic is sound. Punk didn't put up much of a fight but is a big draw. Is 0-1 in the UFC / MMA. So Logic says, if he gets another shot. TUF would be one of his options. Mentioning a title shot and comparing it to the discussion of Punk going on TUF is whats laughable.
Anyways you are missing the point. It doesn't matter if he is signed to the UFC or not. If Dana wants to and if Punk wants to ... he will be on the show. How the conversation goes is irrelevant. I was just pointing out to you that it is possible.
I only watched a few seasons of TUF but I to remember some challenges for the fighters. Didn't they do a scarecrow challenge one year ?
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
Just because anything is possible doesn't mean it will happen.
Can I see him on TUF? Not a hope. For one, if he is on TUF, he's not generating PPV's for at least 6 months. Not a good idea with a guy as old and injury prone as he is. Secondly, he goes on TUF he will get destroyed!!! The UFC has a limited window of opportunity with him which they can't afford to slam shut on their own fingers.
Can I see him fighting again in the UFC? Yes actually as stupid and embarrassing as it would be for all concerned whether he wins or loses. They could really only put him in with a total no mark just like him.
H'es just a symptom of what the UFC has become. I'm all for the ''moneyweight'' fights and grudge matches and superfights and trilogies, but freakshow fights like CM Punk are just a joke.
andyt5303
Rock Star
Silver Level
If he doesn't get another fight with the UFC bellator will be on his ass FAST. Either way it's bad for Punk as a fighter. Sure he'll get a fat(ish) pay check but he'll get his ass beat for it. If he genuinely wants an mma career he's literally got to start at the bottom with the rest of the guys at his level and move his way up. To be honest I only see him having 1 or 2 more fights and then quitting. He'll look back on it positively though, he tried his hardest doing something he's had a passion for his whole life, loved every minute of it and made some decent money while he was at it. Credit to him for taking on a huge challenge either way.
WVHillbilly
Legend
Silver Level
He's too old to have an actual MMA career. The only thing he can do for that is stop wasting time on martial arts and start working on a time machine.
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
Only just now seeing this!!
Are you seriously comparing Cat Zingano to CM Punk and James Toney. How does that even compute in you head?
At the time of that fight Cat Zingano was a seasoned pro and the legit number one contender with years of experience and a string of wins behind her. In fact I'm pretty sure she was undefeated going into that fight. She has beaten the current champ and a former champ (Tate).
I'm wracking my brain here but I just cannot see how you came up with that senseless comparison.
OzExorcist
Broomcorn's uncle
Bronze Level
I don't really see a TUF stint working for CM Punk either - if nothing else it'd probably be too hard on his body (multiple weight cuts etc on top of his injuries - assuming he ever won a fight and needed to do multiple cuts). Plus isn't the whole point of TUF that it's cheap content for the UFC? Punk wouldn't come cheap for a time commitment like that.
And they'd still have the same matchmaking problem. Except instead of having to find just one random broken down guy in his late 30s with no real experience for him to fight, they'd need to find a dozen of them. The reality is pretty much anyone who'd qualify to be on an ordinary season of TUF would look a lot like Mickey Gall - even if they've only got a few fights under their belts, they'll almost certainly have been training MMA for a long time, and would likely make Punk look as bad as Gall did.
As for blatant mismatches that should never have happened, Coutoure v Toney was an obvious skill mismatch but there's been others in the UFC that worried me a lot more in terms of the damage someone could have taken.
Royce Gracie v Matt Hughes for example. That was borderline sanctioned murder. The last Tito-Shamrock fight wasn't far off that either.
Daniel Cormier has had a few too - his fights with both Cummins and Henderson (and his latest one with Silva, despite the extenuating circumstances) were clear and ugly mismatches, only saved by the fact that he seems to be a genuinely nice guy who didn't want to hurt them too badly.
...and let's not forget that the UFC had its own experiments with Kimbo Slice before he ended up on Bellator.
That's just off the top of my head. On the whole the UFC isn't anywhere near as prone to booking dangerous freakshows as Bellator or other smaller promotions are. But let's not pretend they're 100% above it either.
I agree with Rincewind about the Rousey fights though: yes those fights with McMann, Davis, Zingano and Correia were short and brutal for the losers. But they were nothing like Punk v Gall. All of Rousey's opponents had been training for years and had multiple reasonable wins at the pro level. They lost because they made dumb mistakes that Rousey exploited, not because they had no business being in a cage in the first place.
And they'd still have the same matchmaking problem. Except instead of having to find just one random broken down guy in his late 30s with no real experience for him to fight, they'd need to find a dozen of them. The reality is pretty much anyone who'd qualify to be on an ordinary season of TUF would look a lot like Mickey Gall - even if they've only got a few fights under their belts, they'll almost certainly have been training MMA for a long time, and would likely make Punk look as bad as Gall did.
As for blatant mismatches that should never have happened, Coutoure v Toney was an obvious skill mismatch but there's been others in the UFC that worried me a lot more in terms of the damage someone could have taken.
Royce Gracie v Matt Hughes for example. That was borderline sanctioned murder. The last Tito-Shamrock fight wasn't far off that either.
Daniel Cormier has had a few too - his fights with both Cummins and Henderson (and his latest one with Silva, despite the extenuating circumstances) were clear and ugly mismatches, only saved by the fact that he seems to be a genuinely nice guy who didn't want to hurt them too badly.
...and let's not forget that the UFC had its own experiments with Kimbo Slice before he ended up on Bellator.
That's just off the top of my head. On the whole the UFC isn't anywhere near as prone to booking dangerous freakshows as Bellator or other smaller promotions are. But let's not pretend they're 100% above it either.
I agree with Rincewind about the Rousey fights though: yes those fights with McMann, Davis, Zingano and Correia were short and brutal for the losers. But they were nothing like Punk v Gall. All of Rousey's opponents had been training for years and had multiple reasonable wins at the pro level. They lost because they made dumb mistakes that Rousey exploited, not because they had no business being in a cage in the first place.
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underdog140
Legend
Silver Level
I wasn't comparing the skill level or ranking of Punk and Cat .. I was comparing the fight itself. Cat rushed in got taken down and submitted. It was a dominate fight for Ronda. It lasted 16 seconds.
Here is the original post I quoted:
There have been similar one sided fights. Hughes vs. Royce was another one as mentioned by OzExorist.
Like I said it's nothing we haven't seen before.
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
You cant compare fights without comparing fighters involved. Its the fighters that make the fights comparable to each other as much as the outcome. Otherwise there is no basis for comparison. Cat Zingano vs Ronda Rousey is by no means comparable to any fight involving CM Punk or James Toney. Be serious.
Cat Zingano was a lot closer in skill level to Ronda Rousey that CM Punk or James Toney will ever be to a professional MMA fighter.
Jose Aldo, one the most dominant champions in the history of MMA got starched in 13 seconds by Conor McGregor. Could you compare that fight to Punk/Toney's fights as easily as Zingano's??
Gracie/Hughes was a one sided beatdown without a doubt but this and all the fights that were mentioned by OzExorcist all involved skilled and experienced professionals that just happened to be one sided for reasons far beyond having a fighter who had no right to be competing against a professional mixed martial artist.
Even Kimbo, as flawed as he was had a lot more relevant experience than CM Punk.
WVHillbilly
Legend
Silver Level
Speaking of Bellator and has been fighters. Chael's back!
http://www.bjpenn.com/mma-news/chael-sonnen/chael-sonnen-signs-bellator-mma/
http://www.bjpenn.com/mma-news/chael-sonnen/chael-sonnen-signs-bellator-mma/
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
I saw that earlier!!
Apparently Rory Mac has shown an interest in a ''gangsterweight'' fight!!
http://www.lowkickmma.com/UFC/rory-macdonald-calls-out-chael-sonnen-at-gangster-weight/
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
Dont be so sure. Northcutt (blue belt) was pretty easily submitted by a very average blue belt (I think) in Barberena.
Gall, despite his inexperience in MMA is a legit badass brown belt whose lineage is only one step removed from Royler Gracie.
OzExorcist
Broomcorn's uncle
Bronze Level
Yes the ones I mentioned all featured two trained and experienced fighters, but they were still gross mismatches on a pretty similar level to Punk-Gall IMO.
Hughes-Gracie, for example. Yes Gracie was an experienced "mixed martial artist". In reality though he doesn't have much real experience in the "mixed" bit, his "striking" was (and still is) about as bad as Punk's was. Plus there was a pretty big age, size and conditioning disparity.
Similar thing with the Cormier fights. Take Cormier-Cummins. Yes Cummins was a trained MMA fighter who'd had previous pro fights. But the gap between him, a guy with a few regional fights who'd literally been making coffee for a job two days earlier, and Daniel Cormier, seasoned veteran, full-time fighter and the best 205-pound fighter on the planet not named Jon Jones, was about as big as the gap between Punk and Gall.
You're setting yourself up for disappointment if you think that
Fighting GSP would be a no-lose situation for McGregor.If he wins then he beat the welterweight GOAT and has bragging rights forever. If he loses then eh, he lost to the welterweight GOAT, a guy two weight classes up from where he holds his belt. Either way he'll have made dump-trucks full of money with which to buy ridiculous sweaters.
If losing to Nate Diaz didn't end the "Conor show" then clearly nothing else is in a hurry either
OzExorcist
Broomcorn's uncle
Bronze Level
Yeah I'd see that as a fight both guys could win IF they were in the same weight class. That's actually the biggest hurdle, Northcutt is a lightweight and Gall is a welterweight. Who do they think is supposed to move up / down in that spot?
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underdog140
Legend
Silver Level
You are taking what I said out of context and twisting it to fit your comment. My comment was in regards to the fight itself being the most one sided fight a previous poster has seen. There have been plenty of one sided fights. Regardless of skill levels of each individual person.
But to address what you are trying to discuss, Pro-Wrestlers have always tried to cross over and lost in the same type of fashion punk did.
Fedor vs Yuji Nagata at a time when Fedor had around 20 pro fights with only one controversial loss. At that time Nagata was 0-1 and haven't fought in 2 years. His first fight being against Cro-Crop
Bam Bam Bigelow fought Kimo in a one sided beat down back in 1996 and here we are in 2016 with the same type matches still happening. It will never go away.
Pride is known for its miss-matches when it was the #1 org.
Like I said it's nothing we never seen before. And we will see it again with another popular wrestler in the future $$$$.
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
As far as I know and I'm not certain on this but I think Northcutt fought almost exclusively at 170 before entering the UFC.
Judging by Gall's frame and his appearance at the last weigh in I would say 155 is a bit of a stretch for him.
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underdog140
Legend
Silver Level
I am sure everyone's first thought was Silva vs Sonnen but it looks like he is going after Tito.
Greg Beacham @gregbeacham
https://twitter.com/gregbeacham/status/776602312609374208?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
What does everyone think of Sonnen vs. Tito. I personally think this is smart of Sonnen. The Silva fight and interest in it will always be there. No need to go after him right away.
Greg Beacham @gregbeacham
https://twitter.com/gregbeacham/status/776602312609374208?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
What does everyone think of Sonnen vs. Tito. I personally think this is smart of Sonnen. The Silva fight and interest in it will always be there. No need to go after him right away.
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
Pretty sure that, outside of Native American Resrevations, Silva cant fight in the US until the middle of next year anyway.
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underdog140
Legend
Silver Level
That did slip my mind. Maby in Rizin ? I doubt it though. It's too big of a fight for Bellator to give away to another org. I guess we will be seeing Silva vs Sonnen take place sometime during the middle of next year.
OzExorcist
Broomcorn's uncle
Bronze Level
Northcutt's weight division history is actually really weird - he had five pro fights before joining the UFC, and four of those fights were, for some reason, at a 165 pound catchweight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sage_Northcutt
It wasn't until he started fighting in the UFC that he started dropping all the way to lightweight though, you're right.
Rincewind
Visionary
Silver Level
That is very odd. I'm pretty sure that 165 is the equivalent of 75kg. Is it possible that he fought in a promotion that had its weight classes in kgs maybe??