*Don't Touch* Oreo's Cash Game Grind

[xdeucesx]

its also not a useful blanket rule with different textures, obviously a turn raise on AA37 is different from a turn raise on KJ93tt

right obviously, but on this board, gg hand

 

[duggs]

K9 flops worse than QT KJ J9 in my experience and is a reknown donks hands that guys playing 100nl might be expected to avoid. It can't be totally discounted of course because our guy looks fishy but I'm putting more weight to the other hands and especially QT as it's unblocked with almost as many combos as all the 2 pair hands together.
You could argue on combo count alone continuing on the turn is okay but this ignores his obvious passive nature which makes turn raises with 2 pair less likely and this is the point I have been pushing from the start. When we check these spots 95% of the time in my database it's the nuts or close to it.

you realise I said this in my very first post tho right?

 

[duggs]

2 possible scenarios

you are running into 99/JJ only, but given stats he is likely to be wider pre, the more QT he has the more J9 K9 and JQ KQ etc he has, but also the less likely he is to raise those hands on the turn.

here

 

[Figaroo2]

Lol so what are you doing on the turn in that hand?
Honestly I'd probably play it exactly like Oreo, I'm probably not good enough to fold and would want to see more evidence of strength from a river bet before folding (as well as trying to spike a set.)
Against a more aggressive player I'd just gii on the turn

 

[Figaroo2]

One feature that keeps coming up in our hand reviews is that we are happy to rumble with aggressive players in these spots but it actually takes discipline to fold when passives raise.

 

[duggs]

One feature that keeps coming up in our hand reviews is that we are happy to rumble with aggressive players in these spots but it actually takes discipline to fold when passives raise.

but again we dont have alot of information on his passivity really, all we know is some tentative preflop reads, and all that really means is he likes to splash around pre.

 

[duggs]

Lol so what are you doing on the turn in that hand?
Honestly I'd probably play it exactly like Oreo, I'm probably not good enough to fold and would want to see more evidence of strength from a river bet before folding (as well as trying to spike a set.)
Against a more aggressive player I'd just gii on the turn

shove turn. i said shove turn, too strong a hand with money in the middle and a range we do fine against.

 

[Figaroo2]

but again we dont have alot of information on his passivity really, all we know is some tentative preflop reads, and all that really means is he likes to splash around pre.

I agree to a certain extent but imo 40+ hands 20/6 is normally a pretty decent indicator of where someone's stats are heading. Aggressive players usually make themselves known pretty quickly. It takes more hands to properly judge if someone is passive as opposed to just tight but has picked up hands in calling spots.
I don't think a shove is bad here it certainly puts across the right action image and the table less likely to bluff you after.

 

[or3o1990]

I'm a tiny bit annoyed that there's no action before 3pm central on Bovada anymore. I wish we could just skip summer so the fish would be inside playing FR again.

I wasn't exactly thrilled to lay down in either of those spots but I didn't have much choice.

A6 turn barrel just isnt going to make much sense range wise, we have very few Jx and only 3 5x and lots of overpairs/overcards. i think we should check our whole range on the turn.

Noted. I've been a bit semi bluff happy the past several sessions. I haven't missed an opportunity to double a OE or flush draw.

 

[duggs]

I'm a tiny bit annoyed that there's no action before 3pm central on Bovada anymore. I wish we could just skip summer so the fish would be inside playing FR again.

I wasn't exactly thrilled to lay down in either of those spots but I didn't have much choice.



Noted. I've been a bit semi bluff happy the past several sessions. I haven't missed an opportunity to double a OE or flush draw.

sure but think about our equity v a calling range, the flush draw only adds equity against the hands we can to fold out, not the ones that call.

 

[or3o1990]

sure but think about our equity v a calling range, the flush draw only adds equity against the hands we can to fold out, not the ones that call.

True. I have the idea that people will float paired boards wider. So I figured its hard for him to have a J or 5 and that he's letting go of any ace floats an maybe some weak pairs as well. The last part might be a bit optimistic though.

 

[duggs]

True. I have the idea that people will float paired boards wider. So I figured its hard for him to have a J or 5 and that he's letting go of any ace flops an maybe some weak pairs as well. The last part might be a bit optimistic though.

sure, but when he has Jx we are dead in the water, he already had more Jx than us on the flop, this was compensated by us having QQ+ but on the turn we just flipped and now have the weaker range.

 

[or3o1990]

Had a damn meltdown during my evening session tonight. It's the first time I've tilted hard while playing in like 6 months. Spewed a BI. Unacceptable.

 

[Figaroo2]

Had a damn meltdown during my evening session tonight. It's the first time I've tilted hard while playing in like 6 months. Spewed a BI. Unacceptable.

Make sure you understand what caused it, when the same circumstances come around again you will be better equipped to deal with it. At least it was only 1 bi. Happy to talk about the spot later if you want.

 

[or3o1990]

I've just been stuck in this downswing is all. And I was having a solid winning day but then I just started loosing pot after pot and I became frustrated. The past few weeks I haven't been running good and it's kind of terrible timing because I'm headed north to Milwaukee and my cost of living is going to go up dramatically. So I think that because of that the unluck has been getting to me more than it would normally.

There isn't much to say about the spot. It was a clear fold but I chose to GII because I was pissed.

 

[or3o1990]

Had a sweat session with Duggs today and the survery says.... I'm a nit. lol. Thank you though. I've been playing too fit or fold lately and I appreciate the sweat and input.

All in all I had an ok month I guess. It was pretty swingy but I managed to net a profit. Also, I was able to get out of the downswing I was in by the end of my sessions tonight, so there's that.


This is missing about 4.5k hands from WPN where I won a little over 4BI's as well.

 

[xdeucesx]

weeeee nice graph bro!

 

[vinylspiros]

graphs amazing. in the green is always good.

what limit are you playing?

 

[duggs]

Had a sweat session with Duggs today and the survery says.... I'm a nit. lol. Thank you though. I've been playing too fit or fold lately and I appreciate the sweat and input.

All in all I had an ok month I guess. It was pretty swingy but I managed to net a profit. Also, I was able to get out of the downswing I was in by the end of my sessions tonight, so there's that.


This is missing about 4.5k hands from WPN where I won a little over 4BI's as well.

not nitty by any real standard, just a little too 'avoid postflop spots' nitty

 

[or3o1990]

weeeee nice graph bro!

graphs amazing. in the green is always good.

what limit are you playing?

Thanks guys! This is all 100nl. On wpn I'm mixing 50nl and 100nl.

not nitty by any real standard, just a little too 'avoid postflop spots' nitty

Yeah I did pass on some good postflop spots yesterday. I can admit that I've been a bit risk averse lately. I'll have to work on that.

 

[Figaroo2]

Good recovery at the end there to get out of your downswing, well done.
What a great start to the month you had in the first 6000 hands. Is it worth going back over some of the bigger hands in that stretch to see what you were doing right?

I'm wishing you had invited me into the sweat last night as I played pretty poorly and you did warn me not to play...

 

[or3o1990]

Good recovery at the end there to get out of your downswing, well done.
What a great start to the month you had in the first 6000 hands. Is it worth going back over some of the bigger hands in that stretch to see what you were doing right?

I'm wishing you had invited me into the sweat last night as I played pretty poorly and you did warn me not to play...

I don't think that I was doing anything particularly good in the first 6k hands. I was just running really well and was in a ton of easy value spots.

Well you did mention that you were tired when we talked yesterday. Did you think that had something to do with it? Post some hands or skype me and we can look at spots if you'd like.

 

[or3o1990]

Just wrapped up my most loosing cash game session ever. -5.8BI over 1600 hands. Got coolered a few times. Set over set for 180BB, Aces full vs runner runner quads. Sets vs my overpairs all day.. Run bad at it's finest.

 

[xdeucesx]

Just wrapped up my most loosing cash game session ever. -5.8BI over 1600 hands. Got coolered a few times. Set over set for 180BB, Aces full vs runner runner quads. Sets vs my overpairs all day.. Run bad at it's finest.

hang tough. Game of mountains and valleys, but the mountains are higher than the valleys.

 

[duggs]

its rough bro but im sure it will come right man