'Black Friday' and associated fallout megathread

[vanquish]

it's not very difficult to 'crush' freerolls iyam

 

[The Dark Side]

More and more details coming out:

http://www.gambling911.com/gambling...-have-thought-they-were-above-law-041711.html

They even list most of the "shell" companies. Lots of 'em.

This is bad.

Im pretty sure at this point any money that we had on that site is GONE for good.

Knowing how our legal system works theyre going to seize ALL of theyre assets. And dont expect the Gov to try and figure out what belongs to who.
That will be chalked up as "one of the Dangers" to online poker.


Those phone #'s posted ITT. Im calling EVERYDAY this week. We have to be heard. If you dont call. DONT BITCH.

 

[The Dark Side]

Gambling911 is literally the last place you should look for any actual news. They make shit up all the time. They are the National Enquirer of gambling "journalism". Total sensationalist BS and HORRIBLY written to top it off.

Still, I dont think they would pull a list of shell companies out of their ass.

Then LIST them.

 

[WVHillbilly]

Still, I dont think they would pull a list of shell companies out of their ass.

Then LIST them.

No I'm sure those companies were all found in the indictment but what does listing them prove/disprove about the situation? What did the rest of that crappy article have to do with anything? How does FTP being mean to some horrible gambling911 "reporter" years ago relate to the current situation?

 

[The Dark Side]

Gambling911 is literally the last place you should look for any actual news. They make shit up all the time. They are the National Enquirer of gambling "journalism". Total sensationalist BS and HORRIBLY written to top it off.

No I'm sure those companies were all found in the indictment but what does listing them prove/disprove about the situation? What did the rest of that crappy article have to do with anything? How does FTP being mean to some horrible gambling911 "reporter" years ago relate to the current situation?

To us, at this time, it proves nothing.
But what that list can prove is that the poker sites were a major criminal orginization.
And with that proved our poker money will be a memory.


Remember when we had Rolls on FTP WV? Rakeback, Blackcard. Those were the days.

 

[the Styb]

Gambling911 is literally the last place you should look for any actual news. They make shit up all the time. They are the National Enquirer of gambling "journalism". Total sensationalist BS and HORRIBLY written to top it off.

Wow. That link was embarrassing! I've seen children put more coherent content on the web! Spot on WVH!

For those Mac players out there, bodog has an "instant" flash web option. From the Bodog website:

"The flash-based poker client currently allows players to play one Texas Hold'em cash game table and features many of the same innovations as downloadable Bodog Poker client, including a resizable window, a player spotlight that highlights action as it moves around the table, player-to-player chat, game details and other customizable options."


Wow! One Holdem table! Resizeable windows!! Other options!!!

See you at Carbon, while it lasts!

 

[TylerN]

Say it ain't so

 

[WVHillbilly]

To us, at this time, it proves nothing.
But what that list can prove is that the Poker sites were a major criminal orginization.
And with that proved our poker money will be a memory.


Remember when we had Rolls on FTP WV? Rakeback, Blackcard. Those were the days.

I believe we'll get our money. It just might take a while.

 

[vanquish]

everyone will get their money. I can say that with certainty as far as Poker Stars. I already got mine. They would not risk the backlash it would cause in the international community to keep the money.

not to intrude, but how much were you owed/did you get?

 

[TheKAAHK]

not to intrude, but how much were you owed/did you get?

Wasn't owed anything. He committed fraud:

https://www.cardschat.com/forum/community-hangout-4/protest-rally-f-b-i-196206/

 

[ruhrohdingdong]

This is bad.

Im pretty sure at this point any money that we had on that site is GONE for good.

Knowing how our legal system works theyre going to seize ALL of theyre assets. And dont expect the Gov to try and figure out what belongs to who.
That will be chalked up as "one of the Dangers" to online poker.


Those phone #'s posted ITT. Im calling EVERYDAY this week. We have to be heard. If you dont call. DONT BITCH.

I've heard of a few people buying Stars/FTP money at 85c on the dollar. There is a chance it's gone for good but this is very low. Because of the time it'll take to get the money they're probably 95%+ that they'll get the money sometime extra 10% for interest/profits to make it worth their time. I'm still pretty optimistic US players will see FTP/Stars money eventually. UB/AP I wouldn't be so sure about though.

 

[the Styb]

Wow AbAlLa1178, rant much? FYI, Obama didn't start this mess, the Bush administration did. Regardless, neither Bush nor Obama have anything to do with it. Enjoy your fraud! Hope you don't get reported!

 

[usetheion13]

why are only ft, ps, ap, and ub getting raped? why are other sites allowed to stay up such as cake and carbon?

 

[the Styb]

why are only ft, ps, Absolute Poker, and ub getting raped? why are other sites allowed to stay up such as cake and carbon?

Because those three had the misfortune of using international douchebag Daniel Tzvetkoff to launder their money. Rumour has it he was siphoning from them so they pointed the FBI in his direction when he visited Vegas. FBI picked him up on the money laundering charges and denied bail since he was mega-wealthy and considered a flight risk. Then, he somehow made his non-existent bail and the indictments were handed down on the Big Three. No honor among thieves, eh?

 

[KerouacsDog]

while the above is certainly true, I cant help thinking that they targetted the Big Three(biggest 3 in world, along with Party?) as a warning to the other poiker sites to get in line..................

 

[the Styb]

while the above is certainly true, I cant help thinking that they targetted the Big Three(biggest 3 in world, along with Party?) as a warning to the other poiker sites to get in line..................

Oh, I agree! The thing is, the Fed tried to outlaw online poker, then when they realized they couldn't legally do it, they went after the banks and enacted laws which made payment processing illegal, knowing full well that a number of online sites would fire up the Kenmore's to launder our funds. It was only a matter of time before they caught someone and sadly, for us, it happened to be the Big Three. I mean, you really have to screw up huge to hand FT, PS and UB to the Feds while Bodog, which has been a constant deer in the DOJ's headlights, scampers happily across the road unharmed!

 

[OzExorcist]

while the above is certainly true, I cant help thinking that they targetted the Big Three(biggest 3 in world, along with Party?) as a warning to the other poiker sites to get in line..................

Plus I doubt the smaller sites had the funds to buy off their own bank, for example...

 

[KerouacsDog]

lol, very true Oz

 

[Pascal-lf]

The law itself is rather sweeping, with applications far beyond online poker. It's also interesting that Sec. 803 (Internet gambling in or through foreign jurisdictions) fails to make any mention of the fact that it is likely a violation of at least two WTO agreements to which the US is party.

I'm curious - which agreements are these? I'd like to have a look at them

Even though it won't make that much difference, typical time for a WTO dispute is over a year...

 

[TheNoob]

everyone will get their money. I can say that with certainty as far as Poker Stars. I already got mine. They would not risk the backlash it would cause in the international community to keep the money.

When I read this:

"For persons engaged in the business of betting or wagering, it is also a
federal crime to knowingly accept, in connection with the participation of
another person in unlawful internet gambling, credit, electronic fund transfers,
or checks."

It makes me unsure that I want my money (I have WAY less in there than you).

When I play online poker, am I a person that is engaged in the business of
betting or wagering?

 

[the Styb]

When I play online poker, am I a person that is engaged in the business of
betting or wagering?

Does the screen ever say, "TheNoob bets xxx"?

 

[TheNoob]

Does the screen ever say, "TheNoob bets xxx"?

I guess not, but it would be strange to call it a bet in every other
context (like we do here every day) and then somehow not a bet when talking to the FBI.

I doubt I'll ever be talking to the FBI regarding this, of course.

The verbage in their online warning statement did, to someone who
doesn't speak lawyer, give me pause for concern.

 

[Pascal-lf]

You guess not? It definitely says that on mine...

However the way it's worded I'm fairly sure the "person" it talks about are the online poker sites, while you are the "another person" who is engaged in the betting:

"Online poker sites engaged in the business of betting or wagering, it is also a federal crime to knowingly accept, in connection with the participation of
TheNoob in unlawful internet gambling, credit, electronic fund transfers,
or checks."

I think?

 

[Stu_Ungar]

Does the screen ever say, "TheNoob bets xxx"?

It does say "TheNoob raises xxx" in the chat box if you select full dealer messages.

 

[the Styb]

You guess not? It definitely says that on mine...

'Sup Pas!

It definitely says "PlayerX bets XXX" in the hand histories. Thing is, I'm pretty sure the parties they're referring to in the legalese are the site owners, (Tilt, Stars, etc) and the banks, since that's what the actual UIGEA (or whatever the acronym is) concerns itself with.

I don't think the DOJ has the manpower to track down every player in the US either. Of course, the top hundred money winners might be a little easier to find… hell, they can just go to OPR and click on the top players names for Stars and Tilt. enterthewu19 has $1.9 million in earnings in the last two years so he might want to worry if he lives in the US… Me, I'm not gonna sweat the knock on the door about my remaining .59¢