Polished Poker Vol. I Study Group

[or3o1990]

pre needs to be a little bit bigger, bet flop? hoping you are x/r but regardless the range they plan to b/f is going to be too narrow and their xb ranges are too wide for us not to cbet here.

I would have check raised yhe flop for sure. But i thought since i actually had outs that seeing a free card couldnt be that bad?

 

[duggs]

I would have check raised yhe flop for sure. But i thought since i actually had outs that seeing a free card couldnt be that bad?

tell me what your nut bluff barreling combo is then?

 

[or3o1990]

tell me what your nut bluff barreling combo is then?

Im not sure what you mean?

 

[duggs]

Im not sure what you mean?

you need to include at least one bluff combo on this flop cbet, which one do you pick first?

 

[or3o1990]

Idk

 

[John A]

Ok ill make it bigger next time. I didnt cbet on the flop because i don't usually play my monsters that way and i was thinking that my bluff line should look like my value hands would? Also, once i actually floppped a strong draw i wanted to see cards and not get blown off my hand.

The only benifit i can see to betting the flop is that my equity is higher before i miss the turn. But if im the oringinal raiser or the btn im not folding much of what im calling a 3 bet with to a cbet on this flop? Please correct me if im thinking wrong..

You're playing on Bovada though correct? Why are you concerned about balancing your range? I think CRAI on the flop you're going to get called lighter than if you just bet / bet. But yes, a lot of his range is going to call if you bet, but you can set the going price, and most of his range would be able to raise.

 

[or3o1990]

Because i thought i was supposed to be? I know its annonymous and most players at 100nl aren't paying attention but i didn't want to develop bad habits by not doing it. Im always trying to balance my range during sessions so that i can get action..

 

[or3o1990]

And yes i play only on bovada at the moment. Used to play on swc and i want to try acr..

 

[duggs]

You're playing on Bovada though correct? Why are you concerned about balancing your range? I think CRAI on the flop you're going to get called lighter than if you just bet / bet. But yes, a lot of his range is going to call if you bet, but you can set the going price, and most of his range would be able to raise.

if you dont have population tendencies to go on shouldnt we balance our ranges by default?

agree with the rest and agree with betting flop

 

[John A]

Because i thought i was supposed to be? I know its annonymous and most players at 100nl aren't paying attention but i didn't want to develop bad habits by not doing it. Im always trying to balance my range during sessions so that i can get action..

Noppers. You want to approach your game as you're playing against a general player pool, one which has a lot of exploitable tendencies. There's general groups on Bovada... the gamblers that jump in there to get action. The nits who sit and wait for hands and hope no one notices. The fish, and then decent regs and bad regs.

So you want to focus on the holes in each of these groups games, and play them vs. that kind of group. The only group that you care about balancing your range against is the decent regs... but you won't get enough hands on a table to justify you trying to balance. And you should deviate from any balance the first several situations any ways. No one is picking up on anything the first few times you do something.

 

[John A]

if you dont have population tendencies to go on shouldnt we balance our ranges by default?

agree with the rest and agree with betting flop

I meant to say wouldn't be able to raise on the flop....

But, you should have population tendencies if you're paying attention on there at all. Most importantly, about 98% of players you won't get over 100 hands on. Players leave and re-join other tables more frequently on Bovada than any other site because of the anonymity. There's no real reason to stick around unless you have some juicy fish/whales at your table.

There's no reason to balance your range when you have so many player pools with exploitable tendencies. Otherwise I'd agree with you.

 

[or3o1990]

lol, let me have it guys...


PokerStars - $2 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

MP+1: 132.35 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 30.00, 3Bet Preflop: 50.00, Hands: 10)
CO: 84.8 BB (VPIP: 27.27, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
BTN: 84.05 BB (VPIP: 10.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
Hero (SB): 45.5 BB
BB: 106.26 BB (VPIP: 36.36, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
UTG: 98.5 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 7)
UTG+1: 105.29 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
MP: 101 BB (VPIP: 9.09, PFR: 9.09, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has T<font color='red'>♥</font> 9<font color='red'>♥</font>

fold, fold, fold, MP+1 raises to 3.5 BB, CO calls 3.5 BB, fold, Hero calls 3 BB, BB calls 2.5 BB

Flop: (14 BB, 4 players) 4<font color='red'>♥</font> 2<font color='red'>♦</font> T<font color='red'>♦</font>
Hero checks, BB bets 9 BB, fold, fold, Hero raises to 42 BB and is all-in, BB calls 33 BB

Turn: (98 BB, 2 players) 2<font color='black'>♣</font>

River: (98 BB, 2 players) 5<font color='black'>♠</font>

Hero shows T<font color='red'>♥</font> 9<font color='red'>♥</font> (Two Pair, Tens and Twos)
(Pre 31%, Flop 21%, Turn 24%)
BB shows T<font color='black'>♠</font> J<font color='black'>♣</font> (Two Pair, Tens and Twos)
(Pre 69%, Flop 79%, Turn 76%)
BB wins 96.5 BB

 

[or3o1990]

Top pair isn't working out for me today..

PokerStars - $2 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 93.63 BB
SB: 97.85 BB (VPIP: 20.00, PFR: 12.00, 3Bet Preflop: 11.11, Hands: 25)
BB: 83.81 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 12.50, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 24)
UTG: 124.2 BB (VPIP: 33.85, PFR: 10.77, 3Bet Preflop: 3.85, Hands: 65)
UTG+1: 100 BB (VPIP: 5.26, PFR: 5.26, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 19)
MP: 104.78 BB (VPIP: 75.00, PFR: 50.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 4)
MP+1: 205.18 BB (VPIP: 8.47, PFR: 6.78, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 60)
CO: 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, CO posts penalty blind 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.5 BB) Hero has A:diamond: J:club:

fold, fold, MP raises to 4 BB, fold, CO calls 3 BB, Hero calls 4 BB, fold, fold

Flop: (13.5 BB, 3 players) J:heart: 2:spade: 5:club:
MP bets 9 BB, CO calls 9 BB, Hero raises to 25 BB, fold, CO raises to 96 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 64.63 BB and is all-in

Turn: (201.75 BB, 2 players) T:heart:

River: (201.75 BB, 2 players) 3:diamond:

Hero shows A:diamond: J:club: (One Pair, Jacks)
(Pre 28%, Flop 22%, Turn 11%)
CO shows K:club: K:heart: (One Pair, Kings)
(Pre 72%, Flop 78%, Turn 89%)
CO wins 200.25 BB

 

[John A]

lol, let me have it guys...


PokerStars - $2 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

MP+1: 132.35 BB (VPIP: 50.00, PFR: 30.00, 3Bet Preflop: 50.00, Hands: 10)
CO: 84.8 BB (VPIP: 27.27, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
BTN: 84.05 BB (VPIP: 10.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
Hero (SB): 45.5 BB
BB: 106.26 BB (VPIP: 36.36, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
UTG: 98.5 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 7)
UTG+1: 105.29 BB (VPIP: 0.00, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)
MP: 101 BB (VPIP: 9.09, PFR: 9.09, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 11)

Hero posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has T<font color='red'>♥</font> 9<font color='red'>♥</font>

fold, fold, fold, MP+1 raises to 3.5 BB, CO calls 3.5 BB, fold, Hero calls 3 BB, BB calls 2.5 BB

Flop: (14 BB, 4 players) 4<font color='red'>♥</font> 2<font color='red'>♦</font> T<font color='red'>♦</font>
Hero checks, BB bets 9 BB, fold, fold, Hero raises to 42 BB and is all-in, BB calls 33 BB

Turn: (98 BB, 2 players) 2<font color='black'>♣</font>

River: (98 BB, 2 players) 5<font color='black'>♠</font>

Hero shows T<font color='red'>♥</font> 9<font color='red'>♥</font> (Two Pair, Tens and Twos)
(Pre 31%, Flop 21%, Turn 24%)
BB shows T<font color='black'>♠</font> J<font color='black'>♣</font> (Two Pair, Tens and Twos)
(Pre 69%, Flop 79%, Turn 76%)
BB wins 96.5 BB

You're not nearly deep enough to be calling pre. Why are you sitting so short? I'm still confused. I know you said you like to wit until you get to a certain point and then reload, but why? If you're trying to confuse others, make sure you understand what hands you should be playing though with different stack sizes.

 

[John A]

Top pair isn't working out for me today..

PokerStars - $2 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (BTN): 93.63 BB
SB: 97.85 BB (VPIP: 20.00, PFR: 12.00, 3Bet Preflop: 11.11, Hands: 25)
BB: 83.81 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 12.50, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 24)
UTG: 124.2 BB (VPIP: 33.85, PFR: 10.77, 3Bet Preflop: 3.85, Hands: 65)
UTG+1: 100 BB (VPIP: 5.26, PFR: 5.26, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 19)
MP: 104.78 BB (VPIP: 75.00, PFR: 50.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 4)
MP+1: 205.18 BB (VPIP: 8.47, PFR: 6.78, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 60)
CO: 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB, CO posts penalty blind 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.5 BB) Hero has A♦ J♣

fold, fold, MP raises to 4 BB, fold, CO calls 3 BB, Hero calls 4 BB, fold, fold

Flop: (13.5 BB, 3 players) J♥ 2♠ 5♣
MP bets 9 BB, CO calls 9 BB, Hero raises to 25 BB, fold, CO raises to 96 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 64.63 BB and is all-in

Turn: (201.75 BB, 2 players) T♥

River: (201.75 BB, 2 players) 3♦

Hero shows A♦ J♣ (One Pair, Jacks)
(Pre 28%, Flop 22%, Turn 11%)
CO shows K♣ K♥ (One Pair, Kings)
(Pre 72%, Flop 78%, Turn 89%)
CO wins 200.25 BB

Pretty easy fold unless he's a total donk. He flats first bet MW and then shoves to your raise on a dry board. This is 99.8999% of the time a huge hand. You'll need better than tptk.

 

[or3o1990]

You're not nearly deep enough to be calling pre. Why are you sitting so short? I'm still confused. I know you said you like to wit until you get to a certain point and then reload, but why? If you're trying to confuse others, make sure you understand what hands you should be playing though with different stack sizes.

I've actually been buying in short lately, playing a few rotations then adding more if I haven't accumulated yet. But I have to admit I have no experience playing short stacked in cash games.. It was recommended to me and I figured I'd give it a go.

Pretty easy fold unless he's a total donk. He flats first bet MW and then shoves to your raise on a dry board. This is 99.8999% of the time a huge hand. You'll need better than tptk.

Considering he just called after posting I was ruling out the overpairs.. Also, I have a tendency to not believe people who just sat down. I find that they usually mess around a lot more. And I still feel that is true but it's been just the opposite today..

 

[Figaroo2]

9T is a drawing hand and not suitable for playing with a short stack. If you are going to play short make sure you look up the correct short stack strategy!! (its a simple google)
In both hands you are raising with no real evidence that you are ahead, these are both multi-way hands and players are betting strongly in front of you on the flop. When its multi handed you generally need to be stronger to bet and much stronger to raise.
Ttk isnt usually enough here especially on the AJ hand, he's dumping it all in over your flop bet, this is nearly always a set. In fact I think shoving there with KK isn't too clever.
These plays will likely fare better heads up post flop but the only hands that are calling are ones with very good equity.

 

[or3o1990]

9T is a drawing hand and not suitable for playing with a short stack. If you are going to play short make sure you look up the correct short stack strategy!! (its a simple google)
In both hands you are raising with no real evidence that you are ahead, these are both multi-way hands and players are betting strongly in front of you on the flop. When its multi handed you generally need to be stronger to bet and much stronger to raise.
Ttk isnt usually enough here especially on the AJ hand, he's dumping it all in over your flop bet, this is nearly always a set. In fact I think shoving there with KK isn't too clever.
These plays will likely fare better heads up post flop but the only hands that are calling are ones with very good equity.

I don't think I'm going to short stack it anymore.. As for the second hand I'm never believing people who just sat down. Maybe that's dumb but I see all of the time people who first sit down trying so hard to win a hand any way they can right off the bat. Maybe I should start believing lol.

I'm not arguing though. I realize that I played both of these hands very poorly. The past couple of days I've been dead tired. I haven't been playing my A game, not even close to it. I've been getting a bit frustrated because of it..

 

[hutzpaf]

The past couple of days I've been dead tired. I haven't been playing my A game, not even close to it. I've been getting a bit frustrated because of it..

Rest for a couple of days the players won't disappear anywhere. If you continue to play when you are tired, this can happen..

 

[Figaroo2]

The key point is that the hands are multiway so you should be giving them a bit more credit for having a hand when they bet into multiple players.

 

[Figaroo2]

Anyone gambling in these spots

poker stars, $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players

SB: $19.75 (79 bb) VPIP 54, PFR: 36, 3B: 10, AF: 10.0, Hands: 28 maniac
BB: $49.70 (198.8 bb)
UTG+1: $56.83 (227.3 bb) VPIP 27, PFR 16, 3B 6, AF 0.8 Hands74 (fish)
Hero (UTG+2): $35.05 (140.2 bb)
MP1: $25.35 (101.4 bb)
MP2: $27.64 (110.6 bb)
MP3: $29.90 (119.6 bb)
CO: $27.13 (108.5 bb)
BTN: $25.24 (101 bb)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with A:spade: K:diamond:
UTG+1 raises to $0.75, Hero calls $0.75,
I decide to call with the maniac in the blinds.
MP1 calls $0.75, MP2 folds, MP3 calls $0.75, 2 folds, SB raises to $3.50, BB folds, UTG+1 calls $2.75, Hero calls $2.75, 2 folds

Flop: ($12.25) K:heart: J:club: 7:heart: (3 players)
SB bets $5.75, UTG+1 raises to $53.33 and is all-in,
Hero?
Raiser isn't particularly aggressive, no signs of tilt, no history with the maniac. I've been playing TAG and three betting him quite a bit. Don't know if its relevant but both of the other players in the hand are Chinese.

Poker Stars, $0.10/$0.25 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players

SB: $25 (100 bb)
BB: $23.01 (92 bb) VPIP: 34, PFR: 26, 3B: 0, AF: 2.3, Hands: 35 fishy
UTG+1: $25 (100 bb)
UTG+2: $26.70 (106.8 bb)
MP1: $28.47 (113.9 bb)
MP2: $29.93 (119.7 bb)
Hero (MP3): $29.54 (118.2 bb)
CO: $25 (100 bb)
BTN: $28.77 (115.1 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with Q:spade: Q:club:
UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 raises to $0.75, 2 folds, Hero raises to $2.50, 3 folds, BB raises to $23.01 and is all-in,
Hero?

 

[rhombus]

You're not nearly deep enough to be calling pre. Why are you sitting so short? I'm still confused. I know you said you like to wit until you get to a certain point and then reload, but why? If you're trying to confuse others, make sure you understand what hands you should be playing though with different stack sizes.

What are general hands to stack sizes - apart from the deeper you are hands like AT AJ AQ go down in value and suited connectors go up in value and vice versa

i.e. pocket pairs usually want around 20/1 effective stacks, does that apply also to suited connectors

 

[John A]

I've actually been buying in short lately, playing a few rotations then adding more if I haven't accumulated yet. But I have to admit I have no experience playing short stacked in cash games.. It was recommended to me and I figured I'd give it a go.

I'd scrap this strategy honestly. There's no real advantage. If you think you're playing above your buy-in, then just play for full buy-ins lower. IF you want to learn to short stack, then that's a different story, but that's not what I'm hearing.

Considering he just called after posting I was ruling out the overpairs.. Also, I have a tendency to not believe people who just sat down. I find that they usually mess around a lot more. And I still feel that is true but it's been just the opposite today..

Over pairs aren't the only thing that beat you. That line he took, I'd pretty much insta muck anything but sets. That's one of those take it to the bank lines when a fish is trying to tell you he's super strong, so don't plug your ears.

And yes, I agree that if people post early, they will donk around a lot. Especially on Bovada.

 

[Figaroo2]

Less cold calling more 3 betting.

Had an interesting weekend. Opened a couple of 50nl tables on Fri and they 3bet the crap out of me everytime I opened from the CO or BTN. On the 3rd 3bet in a row from the same vill on my left I 4bet AQ and he shoved so I tightened up even more and ended up being too nitty losing half a buy in in 350 hands after I made a silly call call bluff with a busted flush draw and was called by top two pair that I was never shifting him off anyway. I would have finished the session up without the 70bb loss on that one hand.

So I spent a full day reviewing play from the last 3 months including a full Leakbuster trawl.
It picked up on my cold calling again now as critical so I vowed to have a session of 3bet or fold from the blinds at 25nl including opening more in CO & BTN and 3 betting more from those positions as well. What this led to was actually just me not calling where I used to and my vpip dropping into nit values. 3bet was up 3% on usual but all it seemed to lead to were a bunch of 4 bets and playing 3 bet pots oop. I ended up another 2bi down on that session.
The boards kept flopping low as well and I was missing a ton and getting raised out of alot of hands holding AK AQ. Its a fine line to juggle.....and im struggling to find the right balance
Sunday saved my weekend with 4bi up at 25nl

 

[rhombus]

whats your 3betting range from the blinds and how does it differ from different positions?

Should it be higher in the blinds especially from Aggro Late position Openers

for me a good 7% 3Bet range would be something like. Thoughts on 3Betting Range Good/Bad????