Polished Poker Vol. I Study Group

[rhombus]

4 hands from tonight all 3bet preflop and flopped overpair on each, whats usually the best line. All 4 hands had different results

Hand 1
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 3: Hero ( $9.22 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.8, Hands: 56686
Seat 6: Player6 ( $10.78 USD ) - VPIP: 30, PFR: 30, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 10
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Hero posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ 9c 9d ]
Player6 raises [$0.30 USD]
Hero raises [$0.85 USD]
Player6 calls [$0.65 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 4d, 2c, 5s ]

Hand 2
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $10.07 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.8, Hands: 56686
Seat 4: Player4 ( $12.54 USD ) - VPIP: 36, PFR: 36, 3B: 0, AF: 1.0, Hands: 14
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Th Td ]
Player6 raises [$0.40 USD]
Hero raises [$1.35 USD]
Player6 calls [$0.95 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2s, 5s, 8d ]
Player6 checks
Hero bets [$1.60 USD]
Player6 calls [$1.60 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 3c ]
Player6 checks
Hero ??????

Hand3
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 3: Player3 ( $22.34 USD ) - VPIP: 35, PFR: 24, 3B: 13, AF: 12.0, Hands: 62
Seat 6: Hero ( $14.55 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.8, Hands: 56686
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Tc Td ]
Hero raises [$0.30 USD]
Player3 raises [$0.85 USD]
Hero calls [$0.65 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 6c, 9h, 7h ]
Player3 bets [$1.00 USD]
Hero calls [$1.00 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 8d ]
Player3 checks
Hero bets ????????

Hand4
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $24.78 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.8, Hands: 56686
Seat 6: Player6 ( $11.09 USD ) - VPIP: 47, PFR: 40, 3B: 25, AF: 2.0, Hands: 15
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Tc Td ]
Player6 raises [$0.30 USD]
Hero raises [$1.05 USD]
Player6 calls [$0.75 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2s, 9h, 2c ]
Player6 checks
Hero bets [$1.10 USD]
Player6 raises [$2.90 USD]
Hero calls [$1.80 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 8h ]

 

[John A]

That's a big block of hands. Maybe 2 at a time? Are these short tables or 6-max or? I'm having a hard time identifying your position, but maybe I'm just tired. Is there a converter or something you can also use in the future? It's just a lot to sort through when it's not neat and tidy.

 

[rhombus]

That's a big block of hands. Maybe 2 at a time? Are these short tables or 6-max or? I'm having a hard time identifying your position, but maybe I'm just tired. Is there a converter or something you can also use in the future? It's just a lot to sort through when it's not neat and tidy.

sorry just posted as all similar they are all 6MAX and i did take out the players that folded preflop
Whats the best way to post I just normally right click on Hand in Hem and select Copy with Stats. Ill try FTR

Hand 1
poker stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

Button ($18.51)
SB ($11.58)
Hero (BB) ($9.22)
UTG ($12.47)
MP ($11.06)
CO ($10.78)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9

, 9

2 folds, CO raises $0.30, 2 folds, Hero raises $0.85, CO calls $0.65

Flop: ($1.95) 4

, 2

, 5

(2 players)
Hero bets $1.10, 1 fold

Total pot: $1.95

Results below:

Spoiler

Hero had 9

, 9

.
Outcome: Hero won $2.96

Hand 2
Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php

Hero (Button) ($10.07)
SB ($10.20)
BB ($13.37)
UTG ($12.54)
MP ($10)
CO ($9.06)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 10

, 10

2 folds, CO raises $0.40, Hero raises $1.35, 2 folds, CO calls $0.95

Flop: ($2.85) 2

, 5

, 8

(2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $1.60, CO calls $1.60

Turn: ($6.05) 3

(2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $5.78, CO calls $5.78

River: ($17.61) Q

(2 players)
CO bets $0.33 (All-In), Hero calls $0.33

Total pot: $18.27

Results below:

Spoiler

Hero had 10

, 10

(one pair, tens).
CO had K

, K

(one pair, Kings).
Outcome: CO won $17.45

 

[rhombus]

Hand3
Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

Button ($17.67)
SB ($10)
BB ($22.34)
UTG ($11.17)
MP ($12.36)
Hero (CO) ($14.55)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 10

, 10

2 folds, Hero raises $0.30, 2 folds, BB raises $0.85, Hero calls $0.65

Flop: ($1.95) 6

, 9

, 7

(2 players)
BB bets $1, Hero calls $1

Turn: ($3.95) 8

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.88, BB calls $1.88

River: ($7.71) Q

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks

Total pot: $7.71

Results below:

Spoiler

BB had A

, K

(flush, Ace high).
Hero had 10

, 10

(straight, ten high).
Outcome: BB won $7.36

Hand4
Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

Hero (Button) ($24.78)
SB ($10)
BB ($23.78)
UTG ($35.16)
MP ($7.03)
CO ($11.09)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 10

, 10

2 folds, CO raises $0.30, Hero raises $1.05, 2 folds, CO calls $0.75

Flop: ($2.25) 2

, 9

, 2

(2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $1.10, CO raises $2.90, Hero calls $1.80

Turn: ($8.05) 8

(2 players)
CO bets $7.14 (All-In), Hero calls $7.14

River: ($22.33) 9

(2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: $22.33

Results below:

Spoiler

Hero had 10

, 10

(two pair, tens and nines).
CO had A

, 5

(two pair, nines and twos).
Outcome: Hero won $21.33

 

[rhombus]

Also what the hell is it with 10 10, had another one earlier today although figured this was easy fold considering 4B preflop and dont reckon he would have triple ba\rrelled with AK

Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (4 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://www.flopturnriver.com/

UTG ($11.82)
Hero (Button) ($11.68)
SB ($12.52)
BB ($10.67)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 10

, 10

UTG raises $0.25, Hero raises $0.90, 1 fold, BB raises $1.70, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.90

Flop: ($3.90) 6

, 8

, 3

(2 players)
BB bets $2.60, Hero calls $2.60

Turn: ($9.10) J

(2 players)
BB bets $6.27 (All-In), Hero folds

Total pot: $9.10

Results below:

Spoiler

BB didn't show

 

[Figaroo2]

My opinions fwiw...I looked at the hands..typed a reply and then saw you had posted the spoiler...
This is what I wrote prior to seeing the spoilers

Rhom, what I would say is that do you think you are in front in these hands? If you do... stick money in.... if you don't then check it down.
As we mostly have one pair personally i'd be trying to pot control a bit and looking to check one of the rounds rather than inflate the pot only to see an ace/king on the river and face a big bet on the end I can't call.

Hand 1 you have the initiative I would cbet here virtually everytime, I'd be wanting to fold out overcard hands here on the flop/turn and hope 66 77 88 call along for a street or two.
I'd be looking to double barrel a lot here. Most players fold small pairs to 3 bets so it's difficult to see him with a set here. Most AQ type hands might peel one and will fold to the 2nd barrel.

Hand 2
You seem to have muddled player4/6 but its the same scenario as H1 in terms of value and folding out high card hands.

Hand 3
We turn a straight on a wet board so we should be betting more than half pot to charge any draws that might beat us....you must not give a free card here...if they miss their draws on the river you ain't winning any more money, so you must bet the turn.. slow played sets/flush draws aren't going anywhere so you can bet pretty big on this turn.

Hand 4.... John has been teaching us to raise in these circumstances to get AK AQ type hands to fold, just like the fish did here.his raise looks like a testing/probe bet to see if you might fold high overcards...its virtually impossible for him to hit that flop so your call of the flop raise looks correct imo. We just have to hope he has something like 55 66 77. his stack size and stats look fishy so i'd be ranging him a bit wider.
I might consider calling him down if we dont see an ace or king...depends how much he bets on the turn and river.

 

[Figaroo2]

I'm told the editing is just about complete, so hopefully by the end of the week possibly. It will be very soon no matter what.

That's good that you're working on those things! Keep us posted on your stats again.

Comparing my last 10k of hands with my stats for Oct
I've managed to get my vpip in the SB down from 25% in Oct to 19%
My CC in the BB down from 16.2% to 14.2%
My vpip on the butn up from 29.7% to 32.4%
3 bet stats are unchanged though, at 3.7
My vpip/pfr gap has closed by 1% but is still a fishy looking 17/11 FR and 23/15 at 6 max

 

[John A]

sorry just posted as all similar they are all 6MAX and i did take out the players that folded preflop
Whats the best way to post I just normally right click on Hand in Hem and select Copy with Stats. Ill try FTR

Hand 1
Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

Button ($18.51)
SB ($11.58)
Hero (BB) ($9.22)
UTG ($12.47)
MP ($11.06)
CO ($10.78)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9

, 9

2 folds, CO raises $0.30, 2 folds, Hero raises $0.85, CO calls $0.65

Flop: ($1.95) 4

, 2

, 5

(2 players)
Hero bets $1.10, 1 fold

Total pot: $1.95

Results below:

Spoiler

Hero had 9

, 9

.
Outcome: Hero won $2.96

Hand 2
Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php

Hero (Button) ($10.07)
SB ($10.20)
BB ($13.37)
UTG ($12.54)
MP ($10)
CO ($9.06)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 10

, 10

2 folds, CO raises $0.40, Hero raises $1.35, 2 folds, CO calls $0.95

Flop: ($2.85) 2

, 5

, 8

(2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $1.60, CO calls $1.60

Turn: ($6.05) 3

(2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $5.78, CO calls $5.78

River: ($17.61) Q

(2 players)
CO bets $0.33 (All-In), Hero calls $0.33

Total pot: $18.27

Results below:

Spoiler

Hero had 10

, 10

(one pair, tens).
CO had K

, K

(one pair, Kings).
Outcome: CO won $17.45

No problem. I think the best way is if you are using HM2, right click a hand you want to post in the hand grid and select view. Then you'll on the bottom right and export option with pull downs. Select 2+2 format or similar. It will work on CC's, and you can just post the hand. Much much easier to read that way.

Hand 1 is fine.

Hand 2, I'd probably pot control the turn because there's just not enough second best hands he's going to just c/c the flop with in a 3-bet pot. Then you can just call the river if he bets or value bet.

 

[John A]

Hand3
Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

Button ($17.67)
SB ($10)
BB ($22.34)
UTG ($11.17)
MP ($12.36)
Hero (CO) ($14.55)

Preflop: Hero is CO with 10

, 10

2 folds, Hero raises $0.30, 2 folds, BB raises $0.85, Hero calls $0.65

Flop: ($1.95) 6

, 9

, 7

(2 players)
BB bets $1, Hero calls $1

Turn: ($3.95) 8

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.88, BB calls $1.88

River: ($7.71) Q

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks

Total pot: $7.71

Results below:

Spoiler

BB had A

, K

(flush, Ace high).
Hero had 10

, 10

(straight, ten high).
Outcome: BB won $7.36

Hand4
Poker Stars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) - Poker Stars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com/

Hero (Button) ($24.78)
SB ($10)
BB ($23.78)
UTG ($35.16)
MP ($7.03)
CO ($11.09)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 10

, 10

2 folds, CO raises $0.30, Hero raises $1.05, 2 folds, CO calls $0.75

Flop: ($2.25) 2

, 9

, 2

(2 players)
CO checks, Hero bets $1.10, CO raises $2.90, Hero calls $1.80

Turn: ($8.05) 8

(2 players)
CO bets $7.14 (All-In), Hero calls $7.14

River: ($22.33) 9

(2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: $22.33

Results below:

Spoiler

Hero had 10

, 10

(two pair, tens and nines).
CO had A

, 5

(two pair, nines and twos).
Outcome: Hero won $21.33

Hand 3, if he had a flush draw, then he's be betting the turn a ton since there's so much FE in that spot. So when you get to the river, you should be heavily discounted that has and getting it in. It's pretty absurd how he played his hand, but you can't expect most people to play it that bad, even at 10nl. It would help if there were some stats. Maybe if he was super passive there might be a reason not to bet river because he won't call with worse often enough.

Hand 4, looks good, but stats would be helpful. Def one of those boards where bad players will make a play. So I'd GII on the turn like you did.

 

[Aleksei]

Hand 2
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $10.07 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.8, Hands: 56686
Seat 4: Player4 ( $12.54 USD ) - VPIP: 36, PFR: 36, 3B: 0, AF: 1.0, Hands: 14
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Th Td ]
Player6 raises [$0.40 USD]
Hero raises [$1.35 USD]
Player6 calls [$0.95 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2s, 5s, 8d ]
Player6 checks
Hero bets [$1.60 USD]
Player6 calls [$1.60 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 3c ]
Player6 checks
Hero ??????

Fire the turn. At this level, a relative unknown can easily show up with A8, 99, even worse 8x and 77, in addition to spades. If he were monster (KK+, set) we'd have heard about it by now, so the only hands that beat us are JJ and discounted QQ.

Hand3
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 3: Player3 ( $22.34 USD ) - VPIP: 35, PFR: 24, 3B: 13, AF: 12.0, Hands: 62
Seat 6: Hero ( $14.55 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.8, Hands: 56686
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Tc Td ]
Hero raises [$0.30 USD]
Player3 raises [$0.85 USD]
Hero calls [$0.65 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 6c, 9h, 7h ]
Player3 bets [$1.00 USD]
Hero calls [$1.00 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 8d ]
Player3 checks
Hero bets ????????

Raise flop. It's two-tone, so V (who given stats appears to be bad aggro) is probably going to put too many FDs in your range, and happily get stacks in with TP and stuff like Kxhh/Axhh. As played, do like 2/3 pot on the turn. Big enough to get a fair bit of money in if V just calls, but small enough to telegraph some weakness and hopefully induce a raise.

Hand4
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $24.78 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.8, Hands: 56686
Seat 6: Player6 ( $11.09 USD ) - VPIP: 47, PFR: 40, 3B: 25, AF: 2.0, Hands: 15
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Tc Td ]
Player6 raises [$0.30 USD]
Hero raises [$1.05 USD]
Player6 calls [$0.75 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2s, 9h, 2c ]
Player6 checks
Hero bets [$1.10 USD]
Player6 raises [$2.90 USD]
Hero calls [$1.80 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 8h ]

hmm... V seems aggro, but microscopic sample size and postflop aggression seems low. Given that the board is bone-dry and I have little evidence that V is aggro postflop, I might fold the the flop raise. As played, I'd probably fire turn if V checks (capitalize on air that turned FD, the odd 9x that might be getting frisky), fold if he bets again.

 

[John A]

Thanks for jumping back in. That's probably the opposite advice of what I'd say on almost every hand Aleski. Why bet the turn in hand 2? Let's say your opponent does have 8x or 77 in a 3-bet pot. What is really changing on the river? If you put that whole range in there, you're behind. I don't think betting is horrible, but if you consider it's re-raised and you have position, I think it's slightly better to pot control. If it's checked on the river, you can bet, and probably get called by worse a ton, where you may fold out that same range on the turn. You can also induce some busted bets on the river.

Why would you raise the flop in hand 3? You realize you're a big dog against everything that shoves there don't you?

Hand 4, small sample but the guy is clearly over aggro. You don't think he's going to over play some spots a bit too often?

 

[rhombus]

thanks for all advice above guys
and apologise for confusion in hands as posted with stats then tried to make them easier to read without stats

I think the best way is if you are using HM2, right click a hand you want to post in the hand grid and select view. Then you'll on the bottom right and export option with pull downs. Select 2+2 format or similar. It will work on CC's, and you can just post the hand. Much much easier to read that way.

Test Hand (bluff/Value) favourite hand of the week already posted elsewhere
[converted_hand][hand_history]Poker Stars, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

SB: $23.30 (233 bb)
BB: $34.29 (342.9 bb)
UTG: $10.15 (101.5 bb)
Hero (MP): $9.85 (98.5 bb)
CO: $12.35 (123.5 bb)
BTN: $10.76 (107.6 bb)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 5:club: 6:club:
UTG folds, Hero raises to $0.35, CO folds, BTN calls $0.35, 2 folds

Flop: ($0.85) 3:diamond: 2:spade: K:club: (2 players)
Hero bets $0.40, BTN calls $0.40

Turn: ($1.65) K:diamond: (2 players)
Hero bets $0.40, BTN raises to $1, Hero calls $0.60

River: ($3.65) 2:club: (2 players)
Hero bets $1.10, BTN calls $1.10

[spoil]Results: $5.85 pot ($0.26 rake)
Final Board: 3:diamond: 2:spade: K:club: K:diamond: 2:club:
Hero showed 5:club: 6:club: and won $5.59 ($2.74 net)
BTN mucked 5:heart: 4:spade: and lost (-$2.85 net)
[/spoil][/hand_history][/converted_hand]

 

[Aleksei]

Why bet the turn in hand 2? Let's say your opponent does have 8x or 77 in a 3-bet pot. What is really changing on the river? If you put that whole range in there, you're behind.

I mean... he can't have KK+ very often, or he'd have likely shipped it pre. He can't have 2p almost ever either, because the board is low and disconnected, which means we're behind to 88, QQ and JJ. Maybe half the time he raises flop with 88, and half the time he 4bets pre with QQ. So, we're talking 2 combos of set, 6 of JJ, and 3 of QQ. Now -- this is 10NL. I suppose it depends on the site, but my experience is people at this level play too many hands (and since conventional wisdom is that when you play you should come in for a raise I'm finding that they nowadays raise too many hands), and they don't fold enough to 3bet. I've had instances where I got 3bet/bet/bet/bet and V shows up with a mediocre pocket pair, or a really weak top pair (I have seen A8 or even K8 on an 8-high board).

Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my reasoning for firing again when the turn is a low brick.

I don't think betting is horrible, but if you consider it's re-raised and you have position, I think it's slightly better to pot control. If it's checked on the river, you can bet, and probably get called by worse a ton, where you may fold out that same range on the turn. You can also induce some busted bets on the river.

This is reasonable. I'll keep it in mind in the future

Why would you raise the flop in hand 3? You realize you're a big dog against everything that shoves there don't you?

Eh, not really. People go apeshit in 2-tone boards, especially people that appear to be aggressive to begin with. I'm expecting to see hearts, JT, A9, overpairs, and 99 if he ships it.

In retrospect it actually is too thin, but I disagree that we're behind everything that shoves.

Hand 4, small sample but the guy is clearly over aggro. You don't think he's going to over play some spots a bit too often?

He is showing somewhat low postflop aggression stats, but then again he's showing up kinda wide pre, so fair enough.

 

[rhombus]

reason i posted a few of recent TT hands is I noticed a big loss in 5/10 Zoom hands

All hands are 6Max
Top pictue is all hands for last few months and bottom is where I had TT, not sure what ideal BB/100 for hands like this but should be doing alot beter than this

Also I know what the easy answer is fold all TT and stop playing 5/10 and play 10/25

 

[rhombus]

and hands above JJ KQs+ are quite high

 

[Figaroo2]

playing TT

I would only comment that you appear to be 3betting TT over 85% of the time, that seems a bit high for my tastes. What do you do with the hand when you get 4 bet? You don't want to be binning them to a 4 bet, mostly id rather just call and take a flop than 3 bet them.
Attached are my TT stats for the last 6 months my 3 betting is less than half of that. Its not a hand I like to three bet often as if i get 4 bet with it its double tough to play, especially oop facing overs on the flop. I play it the same way as 88 99, and im not getting too attached to it in 3 bet pots either. my win rate seems ok.
JJis +330bb/100 and
99 +158bb/100
so its between the two as might be expected.

 

[rhombus]

I would only comment that you appear to be 3betting TT over 85% of the time, that seems a bit high for my tastes. What do you do with the hand when you get 4 bet? You don't want to be binning them to a 4 bet, mostly id rather just call and take a flop than 3 bet them.
Attached are my TT stats for the last 6 months my 3 betting is less than half of that. Its not a hand I like to three bet often as if i get 4 bet with it its double tough to play, especially oop facing overs on the flop. I play it the same way as 88 99, and im not getting too attached to it in 3 bet pots either. my win rate seems ok.
JJis +330bb/100 and
99 +158bb/100
so its between the two as might be expected.

When i get 4bet I fold when OOP or to a TAG and sometimes call against a LAG when in position, although I get what your saying and essentially I should treat TT as medium pair especially as chance of broadway flopping a broadway card is quite high

 

[John A]

I mean... he can't have KK+ very often, or he'd have likely shipped it pre. He can't have 2p almost ever either, because the board is low and disconnected, which means we're behind to 88, QQ and JJ. Maybe half the time he raises flop with 88, and half the time he 4bets pre with QQ. So, we're talking 2 combos of set, 6 of JJ, and 3 of QQ. Now -- this is 10NL. I suppose it depends on the site, but my experience is people at this level play too many hands (and since conventional wisdom is that when you play you should come in for a raise I'm finding that they nowadays raise too many hands), and they don't fold enough to 3bet. I've had instances where I got 3bet/bet/bet/bet and V shows up with a mediocre pocket pair, or a really weak top pair (I have seen A8 or even K8 on an 8-high board).

Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my reasoning for firing again when the turn is a low brick.


This is reasonable. I'll keep it in mind in the future


Eh, not really. People go apeshit in 2-tone boards, especially people that appear to be aggressive to begin with. I'm expecting to see hearts, JT, A9, overpairs, and 99 if he ships it.

In retrospect it actually is too thin, but I disagree that we're behind everything that shoves.


He is showing somewhat low postflop aggression stats, but then again he's showing up kinda wide pre, so fair enough.

Thanks for your follow up. Just a couple of quick things I noticed that I'd point out.

Be careful with the "he can't have..." type statements. You want to discount certain ranges based on the play, but common things like someone not 4-betting KK pre-flop isn't so out of a persons range. People will commonly just call 3-bets with big hands, especially at these stakes where players aren't as aggressive pre-flop.

Hand 3, You're probably about a 2:1 dog against a shipping range, so I'd say that's significantly behind. I think raising is a little too aggressive in this spot imho.

How has your game been coming along?

 

[John A]

reason i posted a few of recent TT hands is I noticed a big loss in 5/10 Zoom hands

All hands are 6Max
Top pictue is all hands for last few months and bottom is where I had TT, not sure what ideal BB/100 for hands like this but should be doing alot beter than this

Also I know what the easy answer is fold all TT and stop playing 5/10 and play 10/25

Well your stats are looking better in terms of more decisiveness. I hope that's making the game easier for you. We still need to get your aggression up a bit, but everything is looking increasingly better. Good work.

 

[John A]

I would only comment that you appear to be 3betting TT over 85% of the time, that seems a bit high for my tastes. What do you do with the hand when you get 4 bet? You don't want to be binning them to a 4 bet, mostly id rather just call and take a flop than 3 bet them.
Attached are my TT stats for the last 6 months my 3 betting is less than half of that. Its not a hand I like to three bet often as if i get 4 bet with it its double tough to play, especially oop facing overs on the flop. I play it the same way as 88 99, and im not getting too attached to it in 3 bet pots either. my win rate seems ok.
JJis +330bb/100 and
99 +158bb/100
so its between the two as might be expected.

I like your thinking and approach here overall. Only thing I would add is that TT as a 3-bet hand is very situational. You're against an over agro CO who can 4-bet bluff and you're on the button. You should be 3-betting TT. Or same thing in a BvB situation. A decent TAG opens UTG and you're in the CO or button, I'd prefer to flat. You guys probably have that all down.

 

[Aleksei]

How has your game been coming along?

Not that well, in the last few days. Discipline problems... I've been stationing off rivers WAY too much. >_> Working on it.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[John A]

Not that well, in the last few days. Discipline problems... I've been stationing off rivers WAY too much. >_> Working on it.

Thanks for the feedback.

The discipline part is one of the hardest areas in a lot of respects. I think for me, since the games are getting tougher, I'll tilt in some ways that I never would have before. It's interesting and always a work in progress.

Post up some hands where you have questionable turn/rivers. Let's break some of them down.

 

[ph0n3_j4ck]

$25 NLHE 6-max: Awkward situation with bottom full house

Hey guys, since this seems like the most active thread for hand analysis, I'll be posting here more often. Lemme know what I could be doing/changing.

Hero (SB): $39.04 (156.2 bb)
BB: $29.11 (116.4 bb)
MP: $17.87 (71.5 bb)
CO: $13.22 (52.9 bb)
BTN: $26.11 (104.4 bb) vp/pf/ag/3b : 52/14/1.4/11.1

Preflop: Hero is SB with 7

6

2 folds, BTN raises to $0.50, Hero raises to $2.25, BB folds, BTN calls $1.75

Flop: ($4.75) T

J

6

(2 players)
Hero bets $2.75, BTN calls $2.75

Turn: ($10.25) T

(2 players)
Hero bets $4.50, BTN calls $4.50

River: ($19.25) T

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $4.31

 

[Figaroo2]

Well that is a very fine mess you have gotten yourself into.
Otr you are being offered very good odds to look him up.and he could easily have busted draws here they way he just check called the hand down. . But and its quite a big BUT do you want him to see you were playing 76 in this spot? Does it fit with the playing style you are trying to promote at the table. If you don't mind showing then call.
Personally Im folding preflop I would want a stronger starting hand to play oop against a calling station like this guy and your turn bet looks weak so maybe bigger there might have reduced the chances of someone on a draw calling there.

 

[Figaroo2]

Min 4 bet awkward spot

Pacific, $0.10/$0.20 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 7 Players (full ring table)

SB: $29.86 (149.3 bb)
Hero (BB): $20.85 (104.3 bb)
MP1: $14 (70 bb) stats 17/9 agg%31 272 hands 9% opening from UTG...4 bet 33%
MP2: $18.50 (92.5 bb)
MP3: $5.96 (29.8 bb)
CO: $33.15 (165.7 bb)
BTN: $17.01 (85.1 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A♠ K♠
MP1 raises to $0.60, MP2 folds, MP3 calls $0.60, 3 folds, Hero raises to $2.50, MP1 raises to $5, MP3 folds, Hero calls $2.50

Flop: ($10.70) J♥ K♥ 2♣ (2 players)
Hero??
He looks kind of fishy so I decided to call the 4 bet
I just got stuck here and didn't know what to do,
His min 4 bet UTG looks very strong, I dont get 4 bet very often at these stakes out of bvb scenarios and he is pretty much pot committing himself straight away.
I struggled to range him here... the only hand in his perceived range i'm realistically beating is QQ and tying with AK. If he has AA or KK i'm crushed so is there any point betting here? In fact I'm kind of questioning calling the 4 bet oop if I'm not going to bet tptk if I hit in any case...thoughts?