Polished Poker Vol. I Study Group

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rhombus

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forgot to add Stats for Hand 1 version 8205 update for HEM2 seemed ok. Maybe when I copy hand it misses out AG and using Johns Leakbuster HUD
 

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John A

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forgot to add Stats for Hand 1 version 8205 update for HEM2 seemed ok. Maybe when I copy hand it misses out AG and using Johns Leakbuster HUD

How do you like the HUD? Have you gone over the notes on player typing and applied it in game at all? I've played online 10 years, and this is what I think is most helpful, and always curious to hear what others think.
 
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rhombus

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How do you like the HUD? Have you gone over the notes on player typing and applied it in game at all? I've played online 10 years, and this is what I think is most helpful, and always curious to hear what others think.

Ive been using it for 6Max cash games although added Ag on 1st row and 4Bet on last row.

Agree when you said in an earlier post the AGG% seems a better figure than AF

Not sure what you mean gone over notes on Player Typing.

Also not sure about the Raise early and Raise from MP
Are they just a sign of positional awareness i.e. if Raise early is 5% they are premium hands form UTG etc

ALso W$WSF - never really understood that
 
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How do you like the HUD? Have you gone over the notes on player typing and applied it in game at all? I've played online 10 years, and this is what I think is most helpful, and always curious to hear what others think.

I like it a lot. I used to rely on specific stats quite a bit, and this HUD is making me look at players more in a sense of their general play style rather than a collection of stats. I think this is going to be quite useful once I get a good grip on how to deal with each player type.
 
John A

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Ive been using it for 6Max cash games although added Ag on 1st row and 4Bet on last row.

Agree when you said in an earlier post the AGG% seems a better figure than AF

Not sure what you mean gone over notes on Player Typing.

Also not sure about the Raise early and Raise from MP
Are they just a sign of positional awareness i.e. if Raise early is 5% they are premium hands form UTG etc

ALso W$WSF - never really understood that

Gotcha... I don't really think you need 4-bet honestly, but just my opinion. I explain why in the HUD video though.

I meant the player typing like what's in the hitman HUD. Have you read over that document? The one that's here:
http://acepokersolutions.com/Free_Poker_HUDs.php

I'm assuming you haven't because you should understand some of your above questions. You should check it out, I think it would help. I explain that I enter the raise first in from EP and MP because most of my 3-bets are going to come from the CO and buttons. Some regs or other randoms are not very positionally aware, and they will have high %'s from those positions. The ones that do I will 3-bet using my quasi-range (non polarized) and polarized range.

W$WSF gives you a better idea how aggressive that person is overall post flop. It helps you make a better plan for the hand from the start. If this number is low over a decent sample, then I'm floating more. If it's high, then I'm raising or folding in a lot more spots.
 
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I like it a lot. I used to rely on specific stats quite a bit, and this HUD is making me look at players more in a sense of their general play style rather than a collection of stats. I think this is going to be quite useful once I get a good grip on how to deal with each player type.

Bingo.... exactly. And this is my whole point. A lot of people hyper focus on one stat area, which in very large samples CAN be helpful, but most people don't have super large samples. So using the stats in the hitman or leak buster HUD allow you to put together a player type no matter what kind of sample size you have. Even 10 hands or so, you may be able to make a reasonable player type. Then you're trying to think like that kind of player and how he'd think or play situation so that you can make an effective counter strategy.

Common sense in a lot of ways of course, but how and what you use to start building profiles is important. What I put together in that HUD is what I found most useful after trying a lot of things online over the past 10 years. I've used a wall of info like I see on some people's HUD's (almost all of which is not helpful), and as minimal as possible. I've listened and talked HUD's with a lot of top online pros over the years, and this is what I finally ended up with. It's what I use right now myself, and it has kept me consistently winning at a high winrate. It's what I've found is the most useful imho, others may want a wall of stats. I'd just say do the 1 year test. I'm sure you've heard of, if I haven't used it in 1 year, throw it away (for general things in your life). To some people that might be a little extreme, but think about that in terms of the info that is bombarding you on your HUD. If you haven't really used it in a long time or ever, you probably don't need it.

You can also add other stats and build on the HUD as you see appropriate, but I'd assert that it's a really important base to have for practical play.
 
Figaroo2

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John
I use your hud for both full ring and 6 max all the time, there isn't much difference.
I use and understand the stats every hand and have a much better grasp of the player types and how to treat them now than say 3 months ago.
I love the went to showdown stat, I find it a really reliable guide to players who won't go to showdown on the river without the nuts or close to it. Anyone with under 20% here is often getting a large bet in their face on the river if they have shown even a small whisker of weakness along the way.

I also have added 'total 4 bet' and 'fold to 4bet' to the bottom row of the hud and moved total hands to the top row. At 10 and 25nl it is useful to know if your opponent is capable of 4 betting or not. I agree its not necessary at 2 or 5 nl and probably not a higher stakes, its the level were people are just beginning to use 4 betting as a tool. There are several 25nl regs on stars where I have over 2k of hands and they never 4 bet unless its a shove.
At the moment I'm just trying to consolidate and am reading Jared Tendler's mental game book.
You did promise me a coaching session back in post #975 before your house move!
 
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rhombus

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John

I love the went to showdown stat, I find it a really reliable guide to players who won't go to showdown on the river without the nuts or close to it. Anyone with under 20% here is often getting a large bet in their face on the river if they have shown even a small whisker of weakness along the way.

Do you mean W$WSF there isnt a WTSD stat on the Leakbuster HUD
 
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John
I use your hud for both full ring and 6 max all the time, there isn't much difference.
I use and understand the stats every hand and have a much better grasp of the player types and how to treat them now than say 3 months ago.
I love the went to showdown stat, I find it a really reliable guide to players who won't go to showdown on the river without the nuts or close to it. Anyone with under 20% here is often getting a large bet in their face on the river if they have shown even a small whisker of weakness along the way.

I also have added 'total 4 bet' and 'fold to 4bet' to the bottom row of the hud and moved total hands to the top row. At 10 and 25nl it is useful to know if your opponent is capable of 4 betting or not. I agree its not necessary at 2 or 5 nl and probably not a higher stakes, its the level were people are just beginning to use 4 betting as a tool. There are several 25nl regs on stars where I have over 2k of hands and they never 4 bet unless its a shove.
At the moment I'm just trying to consolidate and am reading Jared Tendler's mental game book.
You did promise me a coaching session back in post #975 before your house move!

Awesome. And I'd recommend Jared's book. He's a good guy.

Yes, we do need to get together. It's been one thing after another for me right now. I also had some minor surgery (everything is fine, I'm good) in the middle of last week and have just got my legs back under me as well. So hit me up on skype and we'll connect here soon.
 
Figaroo2

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Do you mean W$WSF there isnt a WTSD stat on the Leakbuster HUD

Rhom Yes technically you are correct its not went to showdown but I understand it to be a similar. If it isn't let me know!
WW$SF
Won when seen flop, if its low then as I understand it they aren't getting to showdown often, or if they do its with weaker hands, the only time i'm not betting hard at a low percentage here is if their overall agg% is low and they are firing at the river.
 
Figaroo2

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Awesome. And I'd recommend Jared's book. He's a good guy.
Yes, we do need to get together. It's been one thing after another for me right now. I also had some minor surgery (everything is fine, I'm good) in the middle of last week and have just got my legs back under me as well. So hit me up on skype and we'll connect here soon.

Thanks John will do soon, not Sunday though, I won a $215 wcoop ticket this evening for wcoop22 in the CC satellite...great value woo woo.:)
 
John A

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Cool.... congrats. Hope you do well in the tourney!
 
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aaaggghhhh tilted for first time in months by a maniac

Started with this hand.... Comments welcome.....
(Full Tilt) $25.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, September 10, 04:07:06 ET 2014 Table Pew (real money)
Seat 8 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $42.49 USD ) - VPIP: 21, PFR: 12, 3B: 4, AF: 2.0, Hands: 158
Seat 2: Player2 ( $31.02 USD ) - VPIP: 19, PFR: 3, 3B: 0, AF: 1.5, Hands: 77
Seat 3: Player3 ( $26.88 USD ) - VPIP: 14, PFR: 11, 3B: 6, AF: 2.0, Hands: 209
Seat 5: Player5 ( $25.35 USD ) - VPIP: 21, PFR: 19, 3B: 11, AF: 6.0, Hands: 188
Seat 6: Player6 ( $30.47 USD ) - VPIP: 14, PFR: 9, 3B: 4, AF: 0.5, Hands: 210
Seat 7: Player7 ( $24.75 USD ) - VPIP: 38, PFR: 19, 3B: 0, AF: 6.0, Hands: 136
Seat 8: Player8 ( $47.45 USD ) - VPIP: 59, PFR: 26, 3B: 17, AF: 4.1, Hands: 101
Seat 9: Player9 ( $25.00 USD ) - VPIP: 13, PFR: 10, 3B: 4, AF: 3.7, Hands: 376
Player9 posts small blind [$0.10 USD].
Hero posts big blind [$0.25 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Js 8c ]
Player2 folds
Player3 folds
Player5 folds
Player6 folds
Player7 calls [$0.25 USD]
Player8 raises [$1.50 USD]
Player9 folds
Hero raises [$3.25 USD] I thought this would get through, he is raising a lot and I hadn't played a hand for several rounds but i hadn't noticed the zero fold to 3 bet. His hitman HUD stats are shown below...
Player7 folds
Player8 calls [$2.00 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ Kd, Qs, 4h ]
Hero bets [$5.14 USD]
Player8 calls [$5.14 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Td ]
Hero bets [$12.34 USD] PICK UP an OESD....should I have just shoved here?
Player8 calls [$12.34 USD]
** Dealing River ** [ 4s ]
Hero checks I figure he isnt going anywhere now so ill save some money
Player8 checks
Hero shows [Js, 8c ]
Player8 shows [Qd, Ac ] called two barrels with 2nd pair!!:(
Player8 wins $40.20 USD from main pot

down to 5 handed
(Full Tilt) $25.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, September 10, 04:58:32 ET 2014
Table Pew (Real Money)
Seat 2 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $35.46 USD )
Seat 2: Player2 ( $20.03 USD ) - VPIP: 50, PFR: 25, 3B: 0, AF: 1.3, Hands: 12
Seat 3: Player3 ( $25.00 USD ) - VPIP: 15, PFR: 14, 3B: 3, AF: 0.0, Hands: 72
Seat 8: Player8 ( $40.44 USD ) - VPIP: 63, PFR: 22, 3B: 17, AF: 4.1, Hands: 101
Seat 9: Player9 ( $30.52 USD ) - VPIP: 13, PFR: 10, 3B: 4, AF: 3.7, Hands: 376
Player3 posts small blind [$0.10 USD].
Player8 posts big blind [$0.25 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ 7c 7h ]
Player9 folds
Hero raises [$0.75 USD]
Player2 folds
Player3 folds
Player8 raises [$1.75 USD]
Hero raises [$3.25 USD]
Player8 calls [$2.00 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ As, 3s, 6s ]
Player8 checks
Hero bets [$4.00 USD]
Player8 raises [$8.00 USD] !!!!!! total air he was doing this every hand
Hero calls [$4.00 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 8s ]
Player8 checks
Hero checks
** Dealing River ** [ Jd ]
Player8 checks
Hero checks
Player8 shows [Jh, 4s ] and he raises me with J4 offsuit and hits a flush....:mad:
Player8 wins $22.90 USD from main pot
Hero doesn't show [7c, 7h ]

I call him down with 3rd pair
(Full Tilt) $25.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, September 10, 04:53:47 ET 2014
Table Pew (Real Money)
Seat 9 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $26.87 USD ) - VPIP: 21, PFR: 13, 3B: 4, AF: 2.0, Hands: 34988
Seat 8: Player8 ( $43.12 USD ) - VPIP: 59, PFR: 26, 3B: 17, AF: 4.1, Hands: 101
Seat 9: Player9 ( $30.87 USD ) - VPIP: 13, PFR: 10, 3B: 4, AF: 3.7, Hands: 376
Hero posts small blind [$0.10 USD].
Player8 posts big blind [$0.25 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Jh 7s ]
Player9 folds
Hero raises [$0.40 USD]
Player8 calls [$0.25 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ Kc, Ad, Js ]
Hero bets [$0.70 USD]
Player8 raises [$1.75 USD]
Hero calls [$1.05 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 4c ]
Hero checks
Player8 bets [$2.50 USD]
Hero calls [$2.50 USD]
** Dealing River ** [ 8h ]
Hero checks
Player8 bets [$5.25 USD]
Hero calls [$5.25 USD]
Player8 shows [Tc, 3d ]
Hero shows [Jh, 7s ]
Hero wins $19.00 USD from main pot

But ending with me making a bad tilting call.....

(Full Tilt)
$25.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, September 10, 05:12:03 ET 2014
Table Pew (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Seat 1: Hero ( $25.00 USD ) - VPIP: 21, PFR: 13, 3B: 4, AF: 2.0, Hands: 34988
Seat 2: Player2 ( $24.65 USD ) - VPIP: 7, PFR: 3, 3B: 0, AF: 2.0, Hands: 30
Seat 3: Player3 ( $27.31 USD ) - VPIP: 15, PFR: 14, 3B: 3, AF: 0.0, Hands: 72
Seat 4: Player4 ( $8.63 USD ) - VPIP: 43, PFR: 0, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 14
Seat 5: Player5 ( $26.70 USD ) - VPIP: 56, PFR: 11, 3B: 0, AF: 5.0, Hands: 9
Seat 6: Player6 ( $28.08 USD ) - VPIP: 77, PFR: 38, 3B: 0, AF: 2.5, Hands: 13
Seat 7: Player7 ( $9.15 USD ) - VPIP: 16, PFR: 12, 3B: 4, AF: 4.0, Hands: 341
Seat 8: Player8 ( $53.61 USD ) - VPIP: 59, PFR: 26, 3B: 17, AF: 4.1, Hands: 101
Seat 9: Player9 ( $28.06 USD ) - VPIP: 13, PFR: 10, 3B: 4, AF: 3.7, Hands: 376
Player4 posts small blind [$0.10 USD].
Player5 posts big blind [$0.25 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Ac Qs ]
Player6 folds
Player7 folds
Player8 checks
Player9 folds
Hero raises [$0.75 USD]
Player2 folds
Player3 folds
Player4 folds
Player5 calls [$0.50 USD]
Player8 raises [$2.50 USD]
Hero raises [$5.00 USD]
Player5 folds
Player8 calls [$3.00 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ Td, 4s, 5h ]
Player8 bets [$47.76 USD]
Hero calls [$19.25 USD]
Player8 shows [Ts, 3s ]
Hero shows [Ac, Qs ]
Player8 wins $28.51 USD
** Dealing Turn ** [ 7s ]
** Dealing River ** [ 4c ]
Player8 wins $48.41 USD from main pot

gave up
 

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Fisi

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Well... I really don't find it good that you play back at maniacs with hands like J7 or J8. Sure, widen your calling and raising range. You might play hands like AT or QJ like you have the nuts if you hit any piece of the flop, however with hands like J8 you rely a lot on your ability to push people out in good spots. Maniacs don't like to be pushed around, so I think you should focus more on just getting value with your wide value range rather than being aggresive with mediocre/bad hands. I would widen my value range to something like A9+, KT+, QT+, JT+ and 77+ and play that aggresively. If I would miss the flop I would just give up right there, unless it's a really good spot to cbet.
 
Figaroo2

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J7 I was bb and he limped but im not defending anything else. Just picking on the wrong villain in the wrong spots with bad bets and letting it get to me.
I needed to be brought back down a peg and realising there is still plenty of work to do.
I was surprised watching this guy play. He stacked at least 5 guys and handed it al back with crazy play. I guess it just tilts me when I can't hit a hand against guys like this.
 
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J7 I was bb and he limped but im not defending anything else. Just picking on the wrong villain in the wrong spots with bad bets and letting it get to me.
I needed to be brought back down a peg and realising there is still plenty of work to do.
I was surprised watching this guy play. He stacked at least 5 guys and handed it al back with crazy play. I guess it just tilts me when I can't hit a hand against guys like this.

Yeah, happens to me often as well. Too often... but hey, we're learning :)
 
John A

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Started with this hand.... Comments welcome.....
(Full Tilt) $25.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, September 10, 04:07:06 ET 2014 Table Pew (Real Money)

If you feel yourself starting to get hot (tilty), just take a break. You can always go back after a few minutes if you feel better. But just practice sitting out for a few minutes. Not too much to say on hands like those. They will happen. People will make goofy plays and then get lucky. Your reads were pretty decent. :)
 
John A

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J7 I was bb and he limped but im not defending anything else. Just picking on the wrong villain in the wrong spots with bad bets and letting it get to me.
I needed to be brought back down a peg and realising there is still plenty of work to do.
I was surprised watching this guy play. He stacked at least 5 guys and handed it al back with crazy play. I guess it just tilts me when I can't hit a hand against guys like this.

These guys are the ones that pay for all of my family vacations now a days. Back in the days, they used to pay for my new cards and what not too, but times have changes. lol

I always do everything I can to ISO these guys and just use position as much as possible. I've shown this in a few videos, but they are there to gamble and mix it up, and usually they aren't very good at picking their spots. Also, most of the time they will make one move, and then not follow it up unless they make a hand or already have a hand. So they are pretty easy to call down against. I have some recent examples that maybe I'll look for.
 
John A

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That was supposed to read new cars, but cards are cool too.
 
John A

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Alright, so I'm going to be putting up a free video series on here. The subtitle is going to be: Beyond the Basics

It's going to talk about foundational issues that need to be in your game, but also go into several common situations that you can exploit that you're likely over looking. It's going to be focusing on 50NL and below. I should have the first video up today.

My recent small stakes play:
Sep_2014.jpg
 
Figaroo2

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Great looking stats John, thats got to be near perfect for 6 max...
looking forward to your new material..bring it on!:)
 
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Great looking stats John, thats got to be near perfect for 6 max...
looking forward to your new material..bring it on!:)
+1 looking forward to it

Have you got any videos on Not Calling when you know when you are beat

I know 90% im beaten and 10% villain a maniac

Ignore stats as Zoom still not working

***** Hand History for Game 1111111111 ***** (poker stars)
$10.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Tuesday, September 16, 04:22:48 ET 2014
Table Klinkenberg (Real Money)
Seat 1 is the button
Seat 1: Player1 ( $18.37 USD ) - VPIP: 12, PFR: 9, 3B: 3, AF: 3.5, Hands: 107
Seat 2: Player2 ( $18.05 USD ) - VPIP: 18, PFR: 18, 3B: 100, AF: 1.0, Hands: 11
Seat 3: Player3 ( $10.00 USD ) - VPIP: 0, PFR: 0, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 3
Seat 4: Player4 ( $11.79 USD ) - VPIP: 18, PFR: 16, 3B: 13, AF: 1.0, Hands: 44
Seat 5: Hero ( $20.33 USD ) - VPIP: 25, PFR: 18, 3B: 8, AF: 1.9, Hands: 42472
Seat 6: Player6 ( $15.69 USD ) - VPIP: 0, PFR: 0, 3B: 0, AF: 0.0, Hands: 1
Player2 posts small blind [$0.05 USD].
Player3 posts big blind [$0.10 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ Ah As ]
Player4 raises [$0.30 USD]
Hero raises [$1.10 USD]
Player6 folds
Player1 folds
Player2 folds
Player3 folds
Player4 calls [$0.80 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2d, 5h, 7s ]
Player4 checks
Hero bets [$1.20 USD]
Player4 calls [$1.20 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Jd ]
Player4 checks
Hero bets [$2.40 USD]
Player4 calls [$2.40 USD]
** Dealing River ** [ 4h ]
Player4 bets [$7.09 USD]
Hero calls [$7.09 USD]
Player4 shows [Jc, Jh ]
Player4 wins $22.66 USD from main pot
Hero doesn't show [Ah, As ]
 
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