Chone2929
Rising Star
Bronze Level
thehangdude
Legend
Platinum Level
There are two main ways to deal with limpers in micro stake mtt. The first is to develop a limping strategy. This allows you to increase your range to include tiny pairs and lower suited connectors. The second way is to increase your opening size. Some people suggest 3XBB + 1XBB per limper.
So UTG and UTG+1 both limp. You are sitting in CO with 44. You could limp behind and hope for a set, or you could raise 5Xbb and hope to lose at least the blinds.
So UTG and UTG+1 both limp. You are sitting in CO with 44. You could limp behind and hope for a set, or you could raise 5Xbb and hope to lose at least the blinds.
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SharkFinn
Rock Star
Silver Level
I think in this situation you have to tighten your range and increase your raise sizing until you stop getting multiple callers. If you're betting 5x, 6x etc. with premium hands and they're calling, that's going to be +EV for you
tazer
Rock Star
Silver Level
I use the 3X + 1BB per limper. If my hand is particularly strong I may just shove over the top of them if I have them covered or chip stacks are similar. Put the pressure on them to call all or most of their stack. We shouldn't be in terrible shape with a strong hand here. Most limpers I feel are speculative hands, but some have monsters so don't shove all the time to give someone a limp/shove strategy with a monster against you.
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caracaski220
Visionary
Bronze Level
caracaski220
If you are in late position and have a few limpers in , you want to raise enough to get most of them out. A pot size bet might not be enough, Make it tough for them to call. If they all fold, even better yet. Thats called limpers tax. Having a feel for the players at the table is important to decide the amount you want to raise.
If you are in late position and have a few limpers in , you want to raise enough to get most of them out. A pot size bet might not be enough, Make it tough for them to call. If they all fold, even better yet. Thats called limpers tax. Having a feel for the players at the table is important to decide the amount you want to raise.
Shumkoolie
Legend
Silver Level
One thing I would like to add, as I agree with this response is that pay attention to villain's tendencies and how they play their limps post-flop. If it's a private Forum Freeroll, like CardsChat, or even an ACR Stormers HomeGame, you're bound to run into the same opponents multiple times. As you gain experience with them, you'll be able to adjust your strategy against them. It's helped me to win a lot of chips in spots.
Make notes on players, it will help you in the future against them.
IntenseHeat
Legend
Bronze Level
I just keep raising. I continue to make it 3x + 1x for each limper up to 5x. Of course you have to take your hand selection into consideration. I always say that I'm willing to raise with my entire range. That way you're not giving away the strength of your hand by raising with the top of your range and limping with the bottom of it. That is to say that you should play hands at the bottom of your range the same way you play hands at the top of it, if you play them. Sometimes, though, you should just fold them. Any hand in my range may be worth a 3x raise. But hands at the bottom of my range may not be worth 5x +. But rather than make a smaller raise, which might give away the strength of my hand, I just fold.
It's my opinion that if you're utilizing proper hand selection, then more often than not you're going to be ahead of the spec hands. If you miss, you might still be able to take the pot down with a simple continuation bet. If not, then don't feel the need to get married to two cards. But when you hit, you might see your opponents call a flop bet on pure spec, hoping to get lucky and make something out of nothing. I've seen players call 5x pre with mediocre starting hands. Then call another 8x on the flop, even after they miss, still hoping to get lucky. Then call another 16x because they picked up a gut shot draw on the turn. They end up having to fold on the river, after throwing away 30x playing a speculative starting hand, when they realize they have no showdown value. After one or two hands like that, they will stop calling your raises, and probably stop limping in front of you all together, so they won't have to limp/fold if you raise.
It's my opinion that if you're utilizing proper hand selection, then more often than not you're going to be ahead of the spec hands. If you miss, you might still be able to take the pot down with a simple continuation bet. If not, then don't feel the need to get married to two cards. But when you hit, you might see your opponents call a flop bet on pure spec, hoping to get lucky and make something out of nothing. I've seen players call 5x pre with mediocre starting hands. Then call another 8x on the flop, even after they miss, still hoping to get lucky. Then call another 16x because they picked up a gut shot draw on the turn. They end up having to fold on the river, after throwing away 30x playing a speculative starting hand, when they realize they have no showdown value. After one or two hands like that, they will stop calling your raises, and probably stop limping in front of you all together, so they won't have to limp/fold if you raise.
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karl coakley
Visionary
Silver Level
I guess you tighten your range and raise your bets. You put enough calling stations together at a table and it can be a bad day.
Even premium hands don't do well 3 and 4 ways.
I wouldn't have much patience with that and would over bet as much as my hands allow (25-30bb) when I had a few limps. I've never felt my tournament swayed on 1 hand and if everyone folded to my AA I would be okay with that.
Lots of ways to deal with calling stations but falling into their game is a bad idea.
Even premium hands don't do well 3 and 4 ways.
I wouldn't have much patience with that and would over bet as much as my hands allow (25-30bb) when I had a few limps. I've never felt my tournament swayed on 1 hand and if everyone folded to my AA I would be okay with that.
Lots of ways to deal with calling stations but falling into their game is a bad idea.
Alex70793
Visionary
Bronze Level
Limpers are great players, if of course you know how to play with them )), do not confuse with those guys who like to go limp with pocket aces or kings, such players are already very dangerous.
There is an old classic system of fighting against limpers, if one player goes limp then put 4-bet, if 2 limpers then put 5-bet, well, and so on, the more limers the more likely that they will fold their cards even on the preflop.
There is an old classic system of fighting against limpers, if one player goes limp then put 4-bet, if 2 limpers then put 5-bet, well, and so on, the more limers the more likely that they will fold their cards even on the preflop.
KidCarter93
Rock Star
Silver Level
A lot of the time when there are too many limpers, or 1 person who is always limping, I'll do as most in this thread have already said - start with bigger opening raises so that at least if they're going to come along it's gonna cost them for the privilege.
Some people are or the mindset that you should never limp, or at least hardly ever limp, as you're inticing more beats into your game and shows that you're a weak player. I'll agree that it can obviously intice more bad beats but certainly doesn't mean you're not a good player. There's a time and a place for any play in poker whether it's limping aces, shoving with 27 or anything in between.
Limping can be very handy if you're becoming a shortstack though. Rather than playing shove or fold poker from say 15BB, you can learn to quite e effectively adopt a great limping strategy which will help you build and maintain a shortstack when lots of others will struggle. This is why I have a decent edge when it comes to shortstacked play as I've spent a lot of time being short in turbos and hypers and still find myself a limping strategy even if I'm on around 5BB. This obviously depends on how the table is playing but a lot of players won't pay much attention and will let you do that without even realising which is how you can manage to exploit them like that.
So, don't listen to those who say limping is terrible. Just make sure you have a plan of what to do and when to do it and it's a great idea!
Some people are or the mindset that you should never limp, or at least hardly ever limp, as you're inticing more beats into your game and shows that you're a weak player. I'll agree that it can obviously intice more bad beats but certainly doesn't mean you're not a good player. There's a time and a place for any play in poker whether it's limping aces, shoving with 27 or anything in between.
Limping can be very handy if you're becoming a shortstack though. Rather than playing shove or fold poker from say 15BB, you can learn to quite e effectively adopt a great limping strategy which will help you build and maintain a shortstack when lots of others will struggle. This is why I have a decent edge when it comes to shortstacked play as I've spent a lot of time being short in turbos and hypers and still find myself a limping strategy even if I'm on around 5BB. This obviously depends on how the table is playing but a lot of players won't pay much attention and will let you do that without even realising which is how you can manage to exploit them like that.
So, don't listen to those who say limping is terrible. Just make sure you have a plan of what to do and when to do it and it's a great idea!
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fundiver199
Legend
Loyaler
Pretty much this. If an isolation raise regularly generate a bloated multiway pot, then either pick a larger size or limp behind and use your postflop position and skill edge instead. With limpers in the pot you can also open shove deeper than without limpers. 3 people have limped in, and you look down on AQo with a 22BB stack sitting in CO. Then you just pile it in and wish good luck to anyone, who wants to come along for the ride. Most of the time you will then either pick it up or get someone to make a ridiculous call with his J8s or some other random hand, that you are ahead off. And then you just hope to get a hold. Jamming over limps also tend to reduce the amount of limping in future hands, which is an added benefit
jordanbillie
Legend
Bronze Level
EnigmaTTO
Enthusiast
Silver Level
I like the suggestions that other people have made previously. Definitely find it kinda annoying when a whole bunch of people are limping all the time and they invariable beat you once or twice with a crap hand that got lucky. I especially like the strategy of increasing raise sizing per limper in the hand cause I feel like it helps differentiate the maniacs from the more passive guys who want to see flops cheap. Plus it also helps you inflate the pot when you have a premium hand and win even more.
IntenseHeat
Legend
Bronze Level
I see quite a few people suggesting a limping strategy, limping with weak hands and raising with strong ones for instance. I'm sorry, but that sounds a little fishy to me. That is to say that's how fish tend to play.
My first thought is that it won't take very long for anyone paying attention to pick up on it. Secondly, when you start limping in with spec hands with the rest of the limpers, you are just playing bingo. In all likelihood, you're going to find yourself bleeding chips. Every time you flop bottom pair or some kind of draw, even a backdoor draw, you're going to feel compelled to continue in the hand and chase your draw. More often then not, you won't get there. And when you do, you'll just be replacing the chips that you lost on the hands when you didn't. In truth, that's pretty much what happens even when you concentrate on playing quality hands. The difference is that when you limp in, you will be doing it against half of the table, which is going to lessen your chances of winning the pot. But when you play higher quality hands, you end up playing less hands and throwing away less chips in the meantime.
Not only that, but playing limped pots with half the table makes it hard to play post flop. It's difficult enough, trying to put a single player on hand. It's exponentially harder to put three or four players on hands. So you're always going to be second guessing whether or not someone is ahead of you. After all, with so many players in the hand, somebody had to flop something, right?
But the question was what to do about the limpers, not whether or not you should join them. I definitely say not to join them. All I can tell you is what has always worked for me. And that's playing tight/aggressive poker, raising 3x + 1x for each limper in front of me. I might not try for the full double up every time I think I'm ahead, but betting two thirds of the pot on three streets tends to build a decent sized pot and take a healthy bite out of a players starting stack. Once I've gone to showdown once or twice and other players see that I'm not raising light or bluffing, then I will start mixing my game up. I'll start switching up between leading out and check/raising and trapping and trying to induce bluffs. As my raises start getting more respect, I'll start opening my range. One thing I make sure to do is to play every hand in my range the same, whether it's A-A or Q-8. If I think my opponents are starting to get comfortable calling me, I might tighten my range up for a little while.
That's what has always worked for me. In fact, it's worked so well that nowadays I often find that my raises get respect from the moment that I come to a table. I attribute this to more and more players utilizing HUDs so that they can see right away my VPIP, PFR and win rate and know right off the bat that they should be respecting my raises. As a matter of fact, it kind of sucks because I find it harder to get action then I used to.
My first thought is that it won't take very long for anyone paying attention to pick up on it. Secondly, when you start limping in with spec hands with the rest of the limpers, you are just playing bingo. In all likelihood, you're going to find yourself bleeding chips. Every time you flop bottom pair or some kind of draw, even a backdoor draw, you're going to feel compelled to continue in the hand and chase your draw. More often then not, you won't get there. And when you do, you'll just be replacing the chips that you lost on the hands when you didn't. In truth, that's pretty much what happens even when you concentrate on playing quality hands. The difference is that when you limp in, you will be doing it against half of the table, which is going to lessen your chances of winning the pot. But when you play higher quality hands, you end up playing less hands and throwing away less chips in the meantime.
Not only that, but playing limped pots with half the table makes it hard to play post flop. It's difficult enough, trying to put a single player on hand. It's exponentially harder to put three or four players on hands. So you're always going to be second guessing whether or not someone is ahead of you. After all, with so many players in the hand, somebody had to flop something, right?
But the question was what to do about the limpers, not whether or not you should join them. I definitely say not to join them. All I can tell you is what has always worked for me. And that's playing tight/aggressive poker, raising 3x + 1x for each limper in front of me. I might not try for the full double up every time I think I'm ahead, but betting two thirds of the pot on three streets tends to build a decent sized pot and take a healthy bite out of a players starting stack. Once I've gone to showdown once or twice and other players see that I'm not raising light or bluffing, then I will start mixing my game up. I'll start switching up between leading out and check/raising and trapping and trying to induce bluffs. As my raises start getting more respect, I'll start opening my range. One thing I make sure to do is to play every hand in my range the same, whether it's A-A or Q-8. If I think my opponents are starting to get comfortable calling me, I might tighten my range up for a little while.
That's what has always worked for me. In fact, it's worked so well that nowadays I often find that my raises get respect from the moment that I come to a table. I attribute this to more and more players utilizing HUDs so that they can see right away my VPIP, PFR and win rate and know right off the bat that they should be respecting my raises. As a matter of fact, it kind of sucks because I find it harder to get action then I used to.
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7CardKillR
Rock Star
Silver Level
Isolate loose linear for value going large with your better hands and smaller with your weaker ones. https://gyazo.com/8b37468ea0e9e1a83fe550f69eb28507
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beejay26
Rising Star
Bronze Level
Potting vs limpers is ideal, for every limper you should consider tightening your range to an earlier position. For example, if you are the CO your CO for pocket pairs should be 44. If there is a limper, then you should make your new cut off to 55, 2 limpers to 66 and etc. Do not be handcuffed to this, I would consider limping every once in awhile or even folding those hands that should be generally involved. Consider the table dynamics first!