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evetsrednow
Rising Star
Bronze Level
luck vs skill
here are some things off the top of my head that require a varying amount of skill...that will affect play.
1) why are you even at the table..whats your motivation?
if it's to 'see hands' then you will probably play too many hands and get stacked time and again. so it takes a form of skill to understand your motivation. if you sit at a table with the plan of not entering a pot until you have premium holdings then the chances of winning money consistently increases as a result of the 'skill' (read: discipline) of being able to fold hands for 3 hours at a time.
2) you playing with scared money? probably. so if you are skillful enough to manage your bankroll then it will free you up just enough to speculate accordingly at an opportune time
3) you well rested...strong, alert? if you dont have this basic 'skill' to show up mentally and physically prepared then you're an easy target
4) you tilt easily or get irritated if i look you straight in the eye and tell intellectual jokes at your expense? note: i can tilt virtually anybody at any table by simply talking to them and not even being rude. you have the skill to ignore this psychological gamesmanship?
5) if you dont have the skill to be composed then i will call the clock on you in a cash game and watch you explode. why is that....no skill yet in keeping cool?
6) you want to chit chat at the table? cool, im exactly like kid poker, just as amiable, will talk about anything and will use all the information against you on a level you dont appreciate or understand...if i think you're a fish who hates Trump i will calmly articulate why he is an American hero and if you love Trump I will calmly articulate why he's a fool. if you're composed i wont be looking to exploit you.
7) you have the skill of not drinking? only suckers drink alcohol at a table. that doesn't mean they're always suckers...it just means for the present session they are suckers. there *is* skill in staying strong and alert.
8) you have the skill to walk away when your decision making is less than stellar or you fancy yourself a noble grinder even at the cost of your buy in?
this is just an incomplete list of random stuff that require a form of skill. and we haven't even gotten into what happens after the deal.
er
here are some things off the top of my head that require a varying amount of skill...that will affect play.
1) why are you even at the table..whats your motivation?
if it's to 'see hands' then you will probably play too many hands and get stacked time and again. so it takes a form of skill to understand your motivation. if you sit at a table with the plan of not entering a pot until you have premium holdings then the chances of winning money consistently increases as a result of the 'skill' (read: discipline) of being able to fold hands for 3 hours at a time.
2) you playing with scared money? probably. so if you are skillful enough to manage your bankroll then it will free you up just enough to speculate accordingly at an opportune time
3) you well rested...strong, alert? if you dont have this basic 'skill' to show up mentally and physically prepared then you're an easy target
4) you tilt easily or get irritated if i look you straight in the eye and tell intellectual jokes at your expense? note: i can tilt virtually anybody at any table by simply talking to them and not even being rude. you have the skill to ignore this psychological gamesmanship?
5) if you dont have the skill to be composed then i will call the clock on you in a cash game and watch you explode. why is that....no skill yet in keeping cool?
6) you want to chit chat at the table? cool, im exactly like kid poker, just as amiable, will talk about anything and will use all the information against you on a level you dont appreciate or understand...if i think you're a fish who hates Trump i will calmly articulate why he is an American hero and if you love Trump I will calmly articulate why he's a fool. if you're composed i wont be looking to exploit you.
7) you have the skill of not drinking? only suckers drink alcohol at a table. that doesn't mean they're always suckers...it just means for the present session they are suckers. there *is* skill in staying strong and alert.
8) you have the skill to walk away when your decision making is less than stellar or you fancy yourself a noble grinder even at the cost of your buy in?
this is just an incomplete list of random stuff that require a form of skill. and we haven't even gotten into what happens after the deal.
er
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Blue_Fossil
Rock Star
Silver Level
Obviously, you need both over time. If you don't have adequate skill, you are not going to have enough good luck to sustain success. The amount of good luck a player needs to run deep in a big tournament will vary based on his skill level. I also think luck is a much bigger variable in tournaments than in cash games. It's highly unlikely you'll make the final table of the Main Event if you don't river the occasional flush against an opponent that caught his straight with the same card, or something similar.
I describe it this way - at least for my own tournament game: I don't feel like I need extraordinary good luck to make a run. Instead, I need to avoid extraordinary bad luck.
Anyway, the more skill you possess, the less you are going to have to rely on luck. The skilled player is better at avoiding trouble, so he won't need to catch the miracle cards to bail him out.
I describe it this way - at least for my own tournament game: I don't feel like I need extraordinary good luck to make a run. Instead, I need to avoid extraordinary bad luck.
Anyway, the more skill you possess, the less you are going to have to rely on luck. The skilled player is better at avoiding trouble, so he won't need to catch the miracle cards to bail him out.
onondaga
Ukraine
Bronze Level
Dont want to write what poker is, the game of luck or the game of skill. The skill also like Luck is the part of this game!
I really like this quote:
" Poker is the game of Luck! The more you play, the luckier you are. "
I really like this quote:
" Poker is the game of Luck! The more you play, the luckier you are. "
C
cardcat
Rising Star
Bronze Level
Poker skill or luck ?
To even ask this question is to say a person has ZERO understanding of poker.
While there is a SMALL element of luck it is Clearly a game of skill.
People who say it is luck are either losing players looking to justify why they lost or they are people who dont understand the math of the game.
You could deal the same exact cards to 10 different people over thousands of hands and a couple of them will be consistent winners and the other 8 will be consistent losers. Its THAT Simple.
To even ask this question is to say a person has ZERO understanding of poker.
While there is a SMALL element of luck it is Clearly a game of skill.
People who say it is luck are either losing players looking to justify why they lost or they are people who dont understand the math of the game.
You could deal the same exact cards to 10 different people over thousands of hands and a couple of them will be consistent winners and the other 8 will be consistent losers. Its THAT Simple.
onondaga
Ukraine
Bronze Level
If u organize the poker game between 100 ppl who even dont know how to write "poker" there will be someone who win this game! Is this mean that this on player is better than rest or he/she just get lucky? And second question, one of big live tourney, two players are all in preflop, TT vs KK, TT win getting flush. Is thats so difficult to calculate? And is it not luck, what do u think?
C
cardcat
Rising Star
Bronze Level
If you had 100 people who knew zero there has to be a winner by default. what part of that dont you get ?
As for your TT vs KK yea there is Some luck involved but not nearly as much as people think.
Tell you what give me a table with 5 guys who are proven plus 10/100 bb players and the other 5 guys who never played poker then let them play 10,000 games. I will Bet EVERYTHING I OWN that the plus 10bb players will win MORE THEN 75% of the games even though they are only 50% of the players.
zubastik
Enthusiast
Silver Level
if you play for big money,the skill is necessary,but if you play in tournaments with small money,there are plenty of fish that rely only on luck,and how can there be a skill,when you're on the turn under 2 aces and 2,6,8, on the table,go all in and win with 2,Jack on the river.I think if you play just with good luck,but without skill,you can win a lot and often,and if you play with skill and without luck you can never win never
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satunya
Rising Star
Bronze Level
hi. I think poker is a game of skill and luck . I play both online and in real life. I scream when I play online when I move for example the Jack 4 against my kings but in real life there are players who are lucky and it is their map and they always reach !!!
supernuts25
Visionary
Bronze Level
The question or statement of a century, definitly SKILL, how much skill or luck i think depends on the style of your play, you can play where theres almost all skill or none at all. and i think thats where it gets tricky and people espeacially people who dont play the game.
mis understanding something or not having knowledge of something is one of the biggest problems we have faced regaurdless of what it is about. and thats where i think this subject lands to many people who havent taken the time to understand something voicing there opioin on this subject and that has affected all poker players everywhere.
from the begining of poker there have been pros its not something new, and if you can make a living at something and not just one person or not just for a moment. Then how can it possibly be luck over skill, You can say that about golf, boxing, basketball, football, and the annoucers in a football game will even say that the coach doesnt want to gamble this early in a game, or they have to get lucky to win this game. Yet all theese games are a staple in america and respected, and a great carreer. But poker is differint , (NO) poker is the same, just misunderstood by unknowledgable poeple. Hell you can say you got lucky on anything, But guess what you do have to get lucky at evrything once in awhile to be succseful at anything.
mis understanding something or not having knowledge of something is one of the biggest problems we have faced regaurdless of what it is about. and thats where i think this subject lands to many people who havent taken the time to understand something voicing there opioin on this subject and that has affected all poker players everywhere.
from the begining of poker there have been pros its not something new, and if you can make a living at something and not just one person or not just for a moment. Then how can it possibly be luck over skill, You can say that about golf, boxing, basketball, football, and the annoucers in a football game will even say that the coach doesnt want to gamble this early in a game, or they have to get lucky to win this game. Yet all theese games are a staple in america and respected, and a great carreer. But poker is differint , (NO) poker is the same, just misunderstood by unknowledgable poeple. Hell you can say you got lucky on anything, But guess what you do have to get lucky at evrything once in awhile to be succseful at anything.
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HoldemStar97
Rising Star
Silver Level
Many new players tell me that poker is a game of luck, and I tell them that this is a game of skill. Luck is just a random factor over which you have no control and it is not so important when you consider all the other variables that can affect you as a player . In poker, the better player will always win more inexperienced , provided that play enough hands. Although luck will affect the results in the short term , eventually the players' skills are what distinguishes winners from losers.
wayrOK
Enthusiast
Silver Level
I 'll say this skill is of course played by winning 75 % , but the remaining 25 % is luck
Good luck to win )