Collective Bias Towards Tournaments

Tero

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We might not see it, we might not recognize it, we might not even care, but it's there alright.

What is? The way we and the whole industry feels differently about tournaments.


Tourney meme

If we compare the standing that tournaments vs cash games have in poker marketing it is pretty much the same as the situation with No Limit Hold'em vs PLO.

And we take that as normal.

What else would it be since the majority of poker site ambassadors, the big names and the smaller ones on Twitch, are mainly tournament players?

One has to ask are tournaments really that lucrative for the big sites even though some of them struggle to fill the overlays sometimes? Or is marketing still so hung up with old times that they are trying to keep the Moneymaker rags to riches dream alive?

Cash games are definitely in the shadows and no-one is making any favors to it. Keeping them under wraps only helps to maintain the skewed image of smokey degenerate gamblers and sharks that are ready to take you to the cleaners. The "fear" towards cash games is not totally uncalled for but it is overly exaggerated.

Poker life

On a more philosophical note we could view tournaments as an analogy to life itself. We each have our starting stack and what we make of it is mostly up to us. Every decision along the way affects our future successes or failures and sometimes the tournament ends abruptly. But all can play only one game.

Cash games resemble more the individuals that were born into a wealthy family. Cash games require even deeper pockets but if you have that the accidental screw-ups doesn't matter. There is always a clean slate waiting behind the next door.


I claim that our bias towards tournaments is mainly in our heads since we are products of marketing (like it or not).

Even majority of our poker discussions in here revolve mostly around tournaments. We love to chase those tournament unicorns that may not even exist.


But how many of the big names actually made their initial roll in tournaments?

I'm not sure. But I do know that Patrik Antonius grinded his starting roll in cash tables.

Now we have a CC game that awards cash dollars only to be used in cash tables. Let's see that as an opportunity to evolve in our poker lives.

To play cash games you don't need to be rich, just slightly better bankrolled than in tournaments. The biggest obstacle is letting go of fear.
 
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Andyreas

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Great post!

I am probably also into the MTT trap. I always tell my wife that some people get lucky and win big amounts but she always mocks me when I will get lucky. 🤣

To me the strategy of cash games is so different which is why I suck at it. Instead of learning them, I only avoid them. 😅
 
dorsk

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Great post!

I am probably also into the MTT trap. I always tell my wife that some people get lucky and win big amounts but she always mocks me when I will get lucky. 🤣

To me the strategy of cash games is so different which is why I suck at it. Instead of learning them, I only avoid them. 😅
Yes, the strategies in cash games are very different. But to me it’s real poker. As the saying goes - MTTs are 80% luck and 20% skills whereas cash games are 80% skills and 20% luck. This is one reason to specialize in cash games. Another reason is TIME. Tournaments are time consuming. In cash games you control the clock.🕰️
Because cash games are more difficult the numbers on Pokerscout tell that at any given time there are ten times more online playing tournaments.
 
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Flyer35

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Cash games are pretty much a sure thing. Tournaments not at all. The former are boring, the latter exciting. I choose excitement even if I lose 9 times out of 10.
 
SpanRmonka

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I think the main reason Tournaments are more popular is because as humans we like to see definitive and comparable results.

In any 1 tournament, you get winner, 2nd etc, plus many more who finisjed whereever they did. For some this may have been a personal best at that level.

Its like a league in sport vs just playing and everyone forgetting cos itbwas juts a game, and didn't mean anything long run.

If I run deepin a tourney thats amazing, but if I just play cash for 3 hours and finish slightly up, there's just no tangible feeling of achievement!!

You can probably tell I'm rubbish at cash!!! Hahaha
 
Tero

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I think the main reason Tournaments are more popular is because as humans we like to see definitive and comparable results.

In any 1 tournament, you get winner, 2nd etc, plus many more who finisjed whereever they did. For some this may have been a personal best at that level.
I think you might be on to something...
Even though people like to think they are making rationalized decisions (when choosing games) there could be deeper issues at play.

Anyone else like to share their thoughts on this?

Feel free to feel !!!
 
Tero

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Tournaments are more popular because they are more of a lottery than cash games and its possible to win a lot in relation to the money spent.
But isn't that what poker players in general try to avoid? We don't play lottery, we're smarter than that - or at least we like to think so.
 
Tero

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Let's get to the root of this. What is keeping you away from cash tables?

Is it the cash monster you are afraid of?
Cash monster
 
PoorGypsy

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actually the big game is my favorite show and I thought actually that cash games are way more popular and that many bad tournaments player actually play more like a cash game players because they probably watch more cash games no?
 
Tero

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actually the big game is my favorite show and I thought actually that cash games are way more popular and that many bad tournaments player actually play more like a cash game players because they probably watch more cash games no?
I think bad players are bad because they do not put in the effort, and they can be too impulsive. Simply watching someone else to play is a hard way to learn, especially if that someone doesn't explain his thought process behind his actions.
 
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Suns of Beaches

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But isn't that what poker players in general try to avoid? We don't play lottery, we're smarter than that - or at least we like to think so.
Imo u can't see poker players as a whole as there are so many different formats and people have different opinions, tastes, lifes, bankrolls etc.

And if u do so then only a small percentage is what I would call smart.

Tournaments sell the dream of winning a lot in a short time without spending too much in relation. The big and quick money. This seems to attract a wide range of players and people in general.
 
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Sparta77

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For me, the cash game is not going to work.. I don't feel it, maybe I crave it very much.Contests are my table.
 
Tero

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Tournaments sell the dream of winning much in a short time without spending too much in relation. The quick money. This seems to attract a wide range of players and people in general.
Yup, short term gains seem to attract some people. There has been even studies about this.

 
PoorGypsy

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If I would have a good bankroll. At list 1000 bucks. I would start play cash. But for now I can not. Even so I can alleady affort to play the lowest buy in cash game. Actually I was suprised how people who has thousands dollars in winnings on 888 play bad. I couldn't undrestand how they win if there calls is modtlt depends on chamce.

Oh, and one more thing about cash games, I do not like to strong gambling feeling that you alwasy have in cash games. in tournaments I feel this less.
 
PoorGypsy

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tournaments feels like more a sport game, like playing chess, when cash is like real gambling
 
Tero

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Oh, and one more thing about cash games, I do not like to strong gambling feeling that you alwasy have in cash games. in tournaments I feel this less.

tournaments feels like more a sport game, like playing chess, when cash is like real gambling
This is good input.
And it tells me that the issues with cash games could be more on the psychological side. I mean on most people.

Poker is harsh and I have never viewed it as any kind of sport. Becoming good at any type of poker requires rising to the occasion and not buckling under pressure, and aquiring skills and using them with logic. But we must learn to see cash games as they are and not as how we fear them to be.
 
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I don't agree at all that marketing influences the players' choice of discipline. Everyone chooses what is most comfortable for them, and marketing attracts players only at the initial stage, and in the end it doesn't influence the players' choice at all.
 
Tero

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I don't agree at all that marketing influences the players' choice of discipline. Everyone chooses what is most comfortable for them, and marketing attracts players only at the initial stage, and in the end it doesn't influence the players' choice at all.
You are free to disagree with me :)

But if we would turn the marketing and game offering on its head the tables would turn for the masses.
 
PoorGypsy

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This is good input.
And it tells me that the issues with cash games could be more on the psychological side. I mean on most people.

Poker is harsh and I have never viewed it as any kind of sport. Becoming good at any type of poker requires rising to the occasion and not buckling under pressure, and aquiring skills and using them with logic. But we must learn to see cash games as they are and not as how we fear them to be.
good point about cash game and skills in poker. I will remember this.

Poker is a sport game. soon they may accept it in olympic games)

just it's a mind sport game
 
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