$ PL O MTT: PLO. Line check please middling stack for tournament life.

[monkeytilter]

Game

Omaha

Game Format

Pot Limit

Table Format

MTT

Freeroll

1. Freeroll

Game Options

1. Turbo

Currency

$

Was my c-bet the right play here? Do I have enough going on vs 2 players or do I take a passive line then bet the "safe" turn?

Villain calling had called bad gut-shot draw on a flushing board in an earlier hand, some I'm pretty happy with my turn shove - but any comments welcome!

partypoker, Omaha Pot Limit - 300/600 (75 ante) - 6 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

UTG: 42,665 (71 bb)
MP: 56,665 (94 bb)
CO: 32,892 (55 bb)
BU (Hero): 17,911 (30 bb)
SB: 49,065 (82 bb)
BB: 100,802 (168 bb)

Pre-Flop: (1,350) Hero is BTN with K♣ 9♠ J♠ Q♣
2 players fold, CO calls 600, Hero raises to 2,700, 1 fold, BB calls 2,100, CO calls 2,100

Flop: (8,850) J♥ K♥ 6♣ (3 players)
BB checks, CO checks, Hero bets 8,850, BB calls 8,850, CO folds

Turn: (26,550) 3♠ (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets 6,286 (all-in), BB calls 6,286

River: (39,122) Q♥ (2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: 39,122

Showdown:
BU (Hero) shows K♣ 9♠ J♠ Q♣ (two pair, Kings and Queens)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 58%, Flop: 83%, Turn: 85%, River: 0%)

BB shows 9♥ 3♣ 9♦ T♦ (a straight, Nine to King)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 42%, Flop: 17%, Turn: 15%, River: 100%)

BB wins 39,122

 

[sibkaz]

6 outs...) just a big stack...)

 

[monkeytilter]

6 outs...) just a big stack...)

Yea I'm not too worried about what villain did (his play was horrible through out the hand) and get drawn out on, more curious about my play and stack off. Deep I'm playing this hand very passively trying to pot control for sure.

 

[eetenor]

Was my c-bet the right play here? Do I have enough going on vs 2 players or do I take a passive line then bet the "safe" turn?

Villain calling had called bad gut-shot draw on a flushing board in an earlier hand, some I'm pretty happy with my turn shove - but any comments welcome!

partypoker, Omaha Pot Limit - 300/600 (75 ante) - 6 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

UTG: 42,665 (71 bb)
MP: 56,665 (94 bb)
CO: 32,892 (55 bb)
BU (Hero): 17,911 (30 bb)
SB: 49,065 (82 bb)
BB: 100,802 (168 bb)

Pre-Flop: (1,350) Hero is BTN with K♣ 9♠ J♠ Q♣
2 players fold, CO calls 600, Hero raises to 2,700, 1 fold, BB calls 2,100, CO calls 2,100

Flop: (8,850) J♥ K♥ 6♣ (3 players)
BB checks, CO checks, Hero bets 8,850, BB calls 8,850, CO folds

Turn: (26,550) 3♠ (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets 6,286 (all-in), BB calls 6,286

River: (39,122) Q♥ (2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: 39,122

Showdown:
BU (Hero) shows K♣ 9♠ J♠ Q♣ (two pair, Kings and Queens)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 58%, Flop: 83%, Turn: 85%, River: 0%)

BB shows 9♥ 3♣ 9♦ T♦ (a straight, Nine to King)
(Equity - Pre-Flop: 42%, Flop: 17%, Turn: 15%, River: 100%)

BB wins 39,122

In PLO MTT tourneys with loose players who would play multiway your preflop raise is incorrect---If you had an A blocker you could raise but flatting this hand is a much better idea--if you could get folds raising is ok but only ok -A blocker really makes a difference- On the flop we have 2 V who do not like to fold and multiple draws and an Spr of 1.77 we can easily check and see a clean turn card and pot turn---We will often in MTT PLO delay our bets until turn to stack protect by equity reduction for our V. If we do bet it is not pot--We would bet a size to set up a pot turn shove to put max pressure on the turn this sizing when called we have 6k left and a pot of 24k or 32k we are never getting turn folds.--- the best play is to check and see a clean turn card.

Wow just wow does that opponent suck---unfortunately suck-out as well

Both of the above strategies in this game - flat preflop -check back flop -pot turn and check back river means we stay alive to get the chips these V are trying to give away. We can also get some donks to fold river with the above strategy but not this donk.

 

[monkeytilter]

In PLO MTT tourneys with loose players who would play multiway your preflop raise is incorrect---If you had an A blocker you could raise but flatting this hand is a much better idea--if you could get folds raising is ok but only ok -A blocker really makes a difference- On the flop we have 2 V who do not like to fold and multiple draws and an Spr of 1.77 we can easily check and see a clean turn card and pot turn---We will often in MTT PLO delay our bets until turn to stack protect by equity reduction for our V. If we do bet it is not pot--We would bet a size to set up a pot turn shove to put max pressure on the turn this sizing when called we have 6k left and a pot of 24k or 32k we are never getting turn folds.--- the best play is to check and see a clean turn card.

Wow just wow does that opponent suck---unfortunately suck-out as well

Both of the above strategies in this game - flat preflop -check back flop -pot turn and check back river means we stay alive to get the chips these V are trying to give away. We can also get some donks to fold river with the above strategy but not this donk.

Can we check flop and fold turn this short? Are we just calling it off on ugly turns with the boat redraw?

 

[monkeytilter]

In PLO MTT tourneys with loose players who would play multiway your preflop raise is incorrect---If you had an A blocker you could raise but flatting this hand is a much better idea--if you could get folds raising is ok but only ok -A blocker really makes a difference- On the flop we have 2 V who do not like to fold and multiple draws and an Spr of 1.77 we can easily check and see a clean turn card and pot turn---We will often in MTT PLO delay our bets until turn to stack protect by equity reduction for our V. If we do bet it is not pot--We would bet a size to set up a pot turn shove to put max pressure on the turn this sizing when called we have 6k left and a pot of 24k or 32k we are never getting turn folds.--- the best play is to check and see a clean turn card.

Wow just wow does that opponent suck---unfortunately suck-out as well

Both of the above strategies in this game - flat preflop -check back flop -pot turn and check back river means we stay alive to get the chips these V are trying to give away. We can also get some donks to fold river with the above strategy but not this donk.

Re-reading your post I think the answer to second question is a deffo NO, this is all about stack preservation.
First question is a bit moot as this shouldn't have been a raised pot, but interested in your answer as played.

I take it your point about "you can consider raise holding A blocker" is so we are less likely to be getting 3 bet by AAxx?

 

[eetenor]

Can we check flop and fold turn this short? Are we just calling it off on ugly turns with the boat redraw?

No our boat redraw is not strong enough vs a player that has no bluffs- we would need two redraws to call vs a nut lead range

 

[eetenor]

Re-reading your post I think the answer to second question is a deffo NO, this is all about stack preservation.
First question is a bit moot as this shouldn't have been a raised pot, but interested in your answer as played.

I take it your point about "you can consider raise holding A blocker" is so we are less likely to be getting 3 bet by AAxx?

when we play vs very weak players they call hands with an A in them at a high frequency so when we have the blocker we get more folds and we can continue on AXX flops and get value from worse Axxx hands---In this spot we are soo short stacked that if an Axx board comes we have to fold more often than not if the V lead and we do not have very strong draws- As well the A blocker means the V cannot have that nut flush draw so we can rep that flush sometimes to get folds---not vs this donk in this spot but other spots at this stack depth

 

[monkeytilter]

No our boat redraw is not strong enough vs a player that has no bluffs- we would need two redraws to call vs a nut lead range

I take your point vs anyone at least semi-decent, fold, wait for better spot (Do worry they running out though as stack getting short!)
Poor villain can be betting top pair/worse two pair though? I see a polarisation errors like this constantly.

 

[eetenor]

I take your point vs anyone at least semi-decent, fold, wait for better spot (Do worry they running out though as stack getting short!)
Poor villain can be betting top pair/worse two pair though? I see a polarisation errors like this constantly.

That is where we adjust if our V have wider lead ranges than the nuts frequently enough then we have to go with the hand at this stack depth--We want to be very careful that we are using several data points and not anecdotal -I have seen it happen- type reads-- we need to know the frequency of these bad leads is high enough to continue---If you are using a tracker that is where you would study- lead spots by OOP villains

 

[monkeytilter]

That is where we adjust if our V have wider lead ranges than the nuts frequently enough then we have to go with the hand at this stack depth--We want to be very careful that we are using several data points and not anecdotal -I have seen it happen- type reads-- we need to know the frequency of these bad leads is high enough to continue---If you are using a tracker that is where you would study- lead spots by OOP villains

No I play on HUDless sites, but take your point. General population doing this like crazy (as they apply NLHE standards to PLO) but you can't just apply that to every villain - get it wrong once and MTT over It is a read I'll work on when seeing villains repeatedly. some just do not what they should consider to be value/bluff.

 

[Bhargav]

your hand is marginal hand. first of all you should not increase the pot pre-flop with marginal hands. raising continuously with two pair against straight draw and flush draw is not right. Hold'em it works, but Omaha straights and flushes are more frequent. you have to be cautious playing two pair.

 

[monkeytilter]

How does

your hand is marginal hand. first of all you should not increase the pot pre-flop with marginal hands. raising continuously with two pair against straight draw and flush draw is not right. Hold'em it works, but Omaha straights and flushes are more frequent. you have to be cautious playing two pair.

How does stack depth/SPR play in to a situation like this?

 

[Bhargav]

Allin is not possible in PLOmaha. When your stack is too small like 10bb, you can throw your complete stack in two steps. Everyone does that only with premium hands, if not possible throw with marginal hands too, because you are close to elimination. search top 30 hands in Omaha in google you will get it.

I can see your stack is 30bb, so if you want to play aggressive wait for premium hands to come, if you want to play with marginal hands then play passive.