€freeroll NL HE MTT: Did I played correct?

PoorGypsy

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So, it's prety easy hand, but still I want to disscuss it and here your thoughts guys.

I'm button with 12 bb.

Blinds are 500/200 with an ante 500

pot 1200

3 person limps

pot 2700

I have 6000

and see A7s and I decide to go all in since everyone limping and pot is already huge for my stack

and suprisingly one player who limped on LJ calling with pocket 10's

she had around 15000 and she just limped pocket 10's

I lost.

How would you play in my case?

and would you ever limp pocket 10's?
 
Tero

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Have you noticed that whenever a player posts a hand example, and asks if the hand was played correctly, more often than not it is a hand the player lost with?
That was from my tilt post.

Like everything in poker - it depends. And most likely you will get answers that support both views.
But ask yourself, if you had won with that hand would you even be asking this question?
 
Hospedar

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I would not do this most part of times, indeed...

I can't have the entire context to decide by myself and to be 100% sure about what I say.

And no matter how many times you try make me understand everything about this situation, you would never be able to let me know everything...



So... I'll say what I think in a general way:

- 3 limpers before you; probably they are all donkeys.
- You have a good hand to shove, indeed, but only if the players behind you were not short stack too, or if there was no limpers and you were the first to act (maybe you could shove against 1 limper in a late position, but you would need to have information about him, of course).
- If you shove against donkeys (specially being short stack), at least one of them will call most part of the times (as bad players love to be calling stations), even with terrible hands (and this is risky, something you have to take care during your session, so remember to keep studying about "fold equity" to avoid these situations).

This little analysis would make me fold my hand easily (to be a little bit more precise, I would need to know everyone's stacks, bubble proximity, players notes, the position of all limpers, blind speed, etc.).
 
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najisami

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Only because it's a freeroll and you're short stacked, I'd say you made the right move. That said, you know that your post lacks a lot of information that could've made me change my mind, right?
Best of luck (y).
 
PoorGypsy

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That was from my tilt post.

Like everything in poker - it depends. And most likely you will get answers that support both views.
But ask yourself, if you had won with that hand would you even be asking this question?
funny thing, I was thinking about it when I was posting this hand.

Of cousre if I would win I wouldn't ask this question. But the thing is that I loose to often and I'm very beginer player (6 month ago started) and for me this kind of nuances interesting. I want to know if most of the time it would be right to play that way or better didn't took this risk with suited Ax. And also I'm thinking is it good to trap this way with 10's, even so I'm not sure if she was traping or just she did'nt wanted to raise after 2 limps
 
PoorGypsy

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I would not do this most part of times, indeed...

I can't have the entire context to decide by myself and to be 100% sure about what I say.

And no matter how many times you try make me understand everything about this situation, you would never be able to let me know everything...



So... I'll say what I think in a general way:

- 3 limpers before you; probably they are all donkeys.
- You have a good hand to shove, indeed, but only if the players behind you were not short stack too, or if there was no limpers and you were the first to act (maybe you could shove against 1 limper in a late position, but you would need to have information about him, of course).
- If you shove against donkeys (specially being short stack), at least one of them will call most part of the times (as bad players love to be calling stations), even with terrible hands (and this is risky, something you have to take care during your session, so remember to keep studying about "fold equity" to avoid these situations).

This little analysis would make me fold my hand easily (to be a little bit more precise, I would need to know everyone's stacks, bubble proximity, players notes, the position of all limpers, blind speed, etc.).
yeah, you made a good point i had to took care about more things. Actually one player on SB had around 7000 stack so she could call. but she is very tight and not a gambling type, she can be just calling with AK, BB had a big stack and she is reall bad beat master, but all in from me she might not call bcause normally I'm tight and I can fold AQof and she knows that, there were 6 more players it was satelite ladies tournament prize 5 tickets for 60 euros, rebuy is 10euro. It was first 1.30 minutes of the game and rebuys still available, We weren 16 players. I didn't plan to rebuy, so I wanted to double up. level up every 15 minutes, 10 minutes already passed so soon we will have blinds raised. First limper was short also around 8000 and she never limps good hand I played with her before, if she limps she doesn't call all in, another player had 10 000 and she also never limps a good hands, and actuslly I got called by player that I nver played before. I saw her hand only one time on BB she had Q5 of and she played it carefully. also one time she put all in when she was short (3800 (around 19bb at that moment)) It was in the begining when I raissed UTG with AQof and got called by 2 players. I had 5000 stack and decide to fold she said she had a pair but she didn't said what exactly. So I had almost no info on her. And when I said "wow you limped pocket 10's she had a tricky smile"
 
PoorGypsy

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yeah, you made a good point i had to took care about more things. Actually one player on SB had around 7000 stack so she could call. but she is very tight and not a gambling type, she can be just calling with AK, BB had a big stack and she is reall bad beat master, but all in from me she might not call bcause normally I'm tight and I can fold AQof and she knows that, there were 6 more players it was satelite ladies tournament prize 5 tickets for 60 euros, rebuy is 10euro. It was first 1.30 minutes of the game and rebuys still available, We weren 16 players. I didn't plan to rebuy, so I wanted to double up. level up every 15 minutes, 10 minutes already passed so soon we will have blinds raised. First limper was short also around 8000 and she never limps good hand I played with her before, if she limps she doesn't call all in, another player had 10 000 and she also never limps a good hands, and actuslly I got called by player that I nver played before. I saw her hand only one time on BB she had Q5 of and she played it carefully. also one time she put all in when she was short (3800 (around 19bb at that moment)) It was in the begining when I raissed UTG with AQof and got called by 2 players. I had 5000 stack and decide to fold she said she had a pair but she didn't said what exactly. So I had almost no info on her. And when I said "wow you limped pocket 10's she had a tricky smile"
oh yeah and positions of limpers were UTG, HJ and LJ
 
PoorGypsy

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Only because it's a freeroll and you're short stacked, I'd say you made the right move. That said, you know that your post lacks a lot of information that could've made me change my mind, right?
Best of luck (y).
yeah you are right I made it to fast I wrote a bit more in later answers if you would like to read I would be happy to hear more advuces from you, so you think in better tournaments with buy in I shouldn't do such all ins being short? should I fold this hand in this case?
 
najisami

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you think in better tournaments with buy in I shouldn't do such all ins being short? should I fold this hand in this case?
In higher buy-ins and if you have a feeling one of the limpers is sneaky, I would've said folding is the best action, but definitely not in any case.
 
Hospedar

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yeah, you made a good point i had to took care about more things. Actually one player on SB had around 7000 stack so she could call. but she is very tight and not a gambling type, she can be just calling with AK, BB had a big stack and she is reall bad beat master, but all in from me she might not call bcause normally I'm tight and I can fold AQof and she knows that, there were 6 more players it was satelite ladies tournament prize 5 tickets for 60 euros, rebuy is 10euro. It was first 1.30 minutes of the game and rebuys still available, We weren 16 players. I didn't plan to rebuy, so I wanted to double up. level up every 15 minutes, 10 minutes already passed so soon we will have blinds raised. First limper was short also around 8000 and she never limps good hand I played with her before, if she limps she doesn't call all in, another player had 10 000 and she also never limps a good hands, and actuslly I got called by player that I nver played before. I saw her hand only one time on BB she had Q5 of and she played it carefully. also one time she put all in when she was short (3800 (around 19bb at that moment)) It was in the begining when I raissed UTG with AQof and got called by 2 players. I had 5000 stack and decide to fold she said she had a pair but she didn't said what exactly. So I had almost no info on her. And when I said "wow you limped pocket 10's she had a tricky smile"

I'm not completely fluent in english lol, so I can't think as quick as would like to give you an actual better answer.

What I can say now with no problems and quickly is:

- Now, I understand a little about why you went all-in.
- But one new information you gave me reinforced what I said about "fold equity": the player who called your shove was exactly the player you had no good notes about. You said you are a newbie, me too, but I have 1,5 year playing this game and studying sometimes, and I would like to recommend you to truly seek more information about "fold equity", then you will put in your mind very good thoughts (like: "I can easily win more money from making people fold before showdown than going with them until the end of everything, as they can win against me, even when they do bad moves").



- Also, as you talked like a lot of villains was short stack, I would like to add one more thing to my other comment: if everyone is short stack, you don't need to be afraid to be short stack to...
- I don't know if this would apply to that hand's situation, but let me try to explain this:
- Imagine if everyone in the tournament has 12bb.
- There's 5 prizes and 20 players.
- If someone doubles up eliminating another player, you will be closer to the prizes and someone will have a larger stack to force other opponents to play worse hands (and this will act like snow ball growing more and more and absorbing other players one by one).
- So you don't need to play every medium strenght hands like A5s or KQ in CO, for example, if you could simply let your opponents get killed by themselves and wait for a better hand, like AQs or TT (specially if the game speed is slow and/or if there is no ante to pay).
- This, obviously, doesn't means you should stop playing every hand you get for being afraid of being eliminated; remember, aggressive players are professional in bothering his opponents. 🙃
- I played a few hundred Spin & Gold at GGPoker, and this taught me very well how to keep calm in such suffocating situations...
 
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monkeytilter

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Main thing here is too make a note on that villain limping so strong with short stacks at the table, this could really help in future decisions if you meet them again. I would guess in a freeroll this a player that views TT as a middling hand so doesn't want to commit too many chips without the flop coming all low - although ironically they'll call off with it🤣

You will occasionally come across more sophisticated players that will limp to trap if they know a short stack behind is likely to jam on them.

You already saw the consensus here that A7s shove to pick up the dead money was fine and I wouldn't argue with that.
 
PoorGypsy

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I'm not completely fluent in english lol, so I can't think as quick as would like to give you an actual better answer.

What I can say now with no problems and quickly is:

- Now, I understand a little about why you went all-in.
- But one new information you gave me reinforced what I said about "fold equity": the player who called your shove was exactly the player you had no good notes about. You said you are a newbie, me too, but I have 1,5 year playing this game and studying sometimes, and I would like to recommend you to truly seek more information about "fold equity", then you will put in your mind very good thoughts (like: "I can easily win more money from making people fold before showdown than going with them until the end of everything, as they can win against me, even when they do bad moves").



- Also, as you talked like a lot of villains was short stack, I would like to add one more thing to my other comment: if everyone is short stack, you don't need to be afraid to be short stack to...
- I don't know if this would apply to that hand's situation, but let me try to explain this:
- Imagine if everyone in the tournament has 12bb.
- There's 5 prizes and 20 players.
- If someone doubles up eliminating another player, you will be closer to the prizes and someone will have a larger stack to force other opponents to play worse hands (and this will act like snow ball growing more and more and absorbing other players one by one).
- So you don't need to play every medium strenght hands like A5s or KQ in CO, for example, if you could simply let your opponents get killed by themselves and wait for a better hand, like AQs or TT (specially if the game speed is slow and/or if there is no ante to pay).
- This, obviously, doesn't means you should stop playing every hand you get for being afraid of being eliminated; remember, aggressive players are professional in bothering his opponents. 🙃
- I played a few hundred Spin & Gold at GGPoker, and this taught me very well how to keep calm in such suffocating situations...
thank you for good advices. You helped me a lot))
 
PoorGypsy

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Main thing here is too make a note on that villain limping so strong with short stacks at the table, this could really help in future decisions if you meet them again. I would guess in a freeroll this a player that views TT as a middling hand so doesn't want to commit too many chips without the flop coming all low - although ironically they'll call off with it🤣

You will occasionally come across more sophisticated players that will limp to trap if they know a short stack behind is likely to jam on them.

You already saw the consensus here that A7s shove to pick up the dead money was fine and I wouldn't argue with that.
good point I would make that note. This hand and comments about it here taught me some new things.
 
Sparta77

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Good hands don't count because in many cases bad hands win.Unfortunately I'm experiencing that.Maybe it's the fault of the system
 
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