$25 NL HE Full Ring: Bluffing in 4bet pot

[Station_Master]

Game

Hold'em

Game Format

No Limit

Stakes

$.10/$.25

Table Format

Full (8-10 seats)

Currency

$

pokerstars, Hold'em No Limit - $0.10/$0.25 - 8 players
Hand delivered by CardsChat

UTG: $29.65 (119 bb)
UTG+1: $27.13 (109 bb)
MP (Hero): $26.44 (106 bb)
MP+1: $28.74 (115 bb)
CO: $24.65 (99 bb)
BU: $20.21 (81 bb)
SB: $25.00 (100 bb)
BB: $24.65 (99 bb)

Pre-Flop: ($0.35) Hero is MP with A♠ K♥
2 players fold, Hero raises to $0.60, 1 fold, CO 3-bets to $2.20, 3 players fold, Hero 4-bets to $5.80, CO calls $3.60

Flop: ($11.95) T♠ 4♥ 5♠ (2 players)
Hero bets $2.80, CO raises to $8, Hero calls $5.20

Turn: ($27.95) T♦ (2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks

River: ($27.95) J♣ (2 players)
Hero bets $12.64 (all-in), CO ?

Not sure if this was a good bluff or spew - your thoughts please!

The player was an unknown from Belgium. His 3 bet was a bit large v my 2.4x open so that helped swing me toward 4betting, as I was getting a worse price and he may be a weaker player.

Important read - he timebanked alot before calling my 4bet, which I read as most likely to be him thinking of folding (though it could be thinking whether to jam AA/KK or just flat in position).

So when the flop raise came, I didn't really believe it. And I would expect a strong hand to slowplay IP. Also in theory I have the equity to continue against say JJ and QQ , even though it will be difficult to realise if he barrels turn. (I have bdfd and bdsd too for a bit more equity).

After the turn checks through, I think he isn't that strong, so decide to bluff the river. Conscious I could be bluffing with the best hand or bluffing him off the chop, but he could also have a low pocket pair, QQ might even fold too. Jamming river would be the line I would take with AA and KK (which is what my hand looks like) so seemed reasonable to bluff, though now with hindsight I wonder if I could check call instead? Not sure on this one.

 

[Aballinamion]

Hero raises to $0.60, 1 fold, CO 3-bets to $2.20, 3 players fold, Hero 4-bets to $5.80, CO calls $3.60

As I said before on other hand analysis, quit the overthinking as soon as possible. You are a gifted and talented player with whole knowledge of GTO and Exploitative Game, so try to think as less as you can and when you are at the tables grinding, let your instincts command your actions not your reason.
I don't like 4-betting using AK off-suited combos for a basic motive that we own 12 combos of AKo, and this increases our 4-bet range quite a bit.
I rather 4-bet using A3s, A4s or A5s instead of using AKo, because although we own some removal of AA and AK, our equity won't realize that often as it we were holding AKs.

Hero bets $2.80, CO raises to $8, Hero calls $5.20

As I said we only have small equity and now we are calling a raise on the flop without knowing where it will take us further.

Hero bets $12.64 (all-in), CO ?

This move is valid and correct once we have plenty of information that CO villain is a good regular that will understand your move as a polarized one: that either you have the nuts or you have the bluffs. And CO having some bluffs as well and folding in some frequency is already good enough for us to put up a shove on the river.
If you had all of these info that's okay and no matter the results we move always forward without looking to the past.
The hand was well played but I wouldn't have made a 4-bet preflop, I would just have called the 3-bet.

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
I agree with the previous reply, that we dont always have to 4-bet here. Its ok to just call with AKo and strengthen our calling range. In that way now its suddenly us, who sometimes "cooler" him on a A high board rather than the opposite.

Flop
I guess, the small C-bet is fine, but when he raise, I am done with the hand. You need to realise around 20% equity to continue, and you dont have that, unless you have two free overcards and get to see both the turn and the river. Which is a best case scenario, that will almost never happen. I dont agree, that this is likely to be a bluff. You hold As making it less likely, he is raising a flushdraw, and he can certainly play JJ or QQ this way, including the tanking preflop and raising the flop "for protection".

Turn
Now he check back, and this could mean a number of things. It could be a draw wanting to see the last card for free, but it could also be QQ or JJ being a little scared of trips or just realising, there is only one bet left, so why not delay it to the river.

River
I just dont see, which better hand he arrive with here, that is now going to fold? JJ just made top boat, and QQ is not scared of the J and will likely find a hero call, since.... well.... it still beat AK. So for me this is a check-fold spot, but I would have folded already on the flop, or not made the 4-bet preflop.

Conclusion
I think, this is a prime example of overplaying AK. Its a good hand preflop, because it has blockers to AA and KK and is ahead of anything but pocket pairs. But when we get action and whiff completely, we have to let it go at some point.

 

[Station_Master]

Preflop
I agree with the previous reply, that we dont always have to 4-bet here. Its ok to just call with AKo and strengthen our calling range. In that way now its suddenly us, who sometimes "cooler" him on a A high board rather than the opposite.

Flop
I guess, the small C-bet is fine, but when he raise, I am done with the hand. You need to realise around 20% equity to continue, and you dont have that, unless you have two free overcards and get to see both the turn and the river. Which is a best case scenario, that will almost never happen. I dont agree, that this is likely to be a bluff. You hold As making it less likely, he is raising a flushdraw, and he can certainly play JJ or QQ this way, including the tanking preflop and raising the flop "for protection".

Turn
Now he check back, and this could mean a number of things. It could be a draw wanting to see the last card for free, but it could also be QQ or JJ being a little scared of trips or just realising, there is only one bet left, so why not delay it to the river.

River
I just dont see, which better hand he arrive with here, that is now going to fold? JJ just made top boat, and QQ is not scared of the J and will likely find a hero call, since.... well.... it still beat AK. So for me this is a check-fold spot, but I would have folded already on the flop, or not made the 4-bet preflop.

Conclusion
I think, this is a prime example of overplaying AK. Its a good hand preflop, because it has blockers to AA and KK and is ahead of anything but pocket pairs. But when we get action and whiff completely, we have to let it go at some point.

Thanks, I was kind of expecting these comments from you! as I know my post flop play is a little non-standard.

Slightly surprised though that you and @Aballinamion have issues with the 4bet, its the standard GTO play in this spot (with the occasional call) - AK does not play that well out of position in a 3bet pot and we can't let our opponents run us over with 3bets.

Post flop, I was heavily influenced by my read that the villain was weak, I also think a flop raise is rather suspicious when in position, as its unnecesary with value. I think i can realise enough equity to call (just, as i think he will slow down on alot of turns).

The river is where I have most doubt, maybe i have enough showdown value to even check call, check-fold is my least preferred line. As to better hands that fold AK (off a chop, 9 combos and in my mind the most likely hand to take this line), maybe 99,88,77 and AJs too (at a partial frequency). But I also would be quite happy for AQ to fold and not have the opportunity to bluff me!

 

[fundiver199]

Slightly surprised though that you and @Aballinamion have issues with the 4bet, its the standard GTO play in this spot (with the occasional call) - AK does not play that well out of position in a 3bet pot and we can't let our opponents run us over with 3bets.

I dont have an issue with the 4-bet. Just wanted to point out, that there are other options. I checked the situation with GTO Wizard, and actually the program mainly jam AKo for 100BB, whereas AKs is used for a small 4-bet. This is somewhat surpricing to me, but I guess, it highlight the point, that AKo dont play that well out of position.

Post flop, I was heavily influenced by my read that the villain was weak, I also think a flop raise is rather suspicious when in position, as its unnecesary with value.

I can see, where you are coming from here. It is indeed a weird spot for him to be raising, and solvers might not have any raising range at all. I cant check this though, since I typed in a wrong flop, and when I changed it, I hit the payment wall of GTO Wizard. Raising as a bluff dont make much sense either though, since he is giving you a great price to call, and he reopen the betting and risk getting jammed on.

I think i can realise enough equity to call (just, as i think he will slow down on alot of turns).

Raising flop and checking back turn is not a common line, and probably not a very good one either. If he raise the flop for value, his hand should be good enough to jam the turn, and if he raised as a bluff, then he should also continue his story and jam the turn. So even though he did check back turn this time, that is not something, I would expect to happen very often at all.

The river is where I have most doubt, maybe i have enough showdown value to even check call, check-fold is my least preferred line. As to better hands that fold AK (off a chop, 9 combos and in my mind the most likely hand to take this line), maybe 99,88,77 and AJs too (at a partial frequency). But I also would be quite happy for AQ to fold and not have the opportunity to bluff me!

I just dont see, why AK, AQ or 77-99 would raise the flop? Those hands should all be a square call. 77-99 are also not a common 3-bet preflop against an UTG open. Its difficult to figure out, what he can even have here, since his line is so weird. But my best guess is TT-QQ and maybe some busted flushdraws, but some of those paired on the J. So I dont think, you have the best hand here almost ever. Maybe you beat KQ of spades, but thats literally one combo. So I definitely dont think, you can check-call, and I also dont think, you are getting enough folds, when you jam.

 

[John A]

If you were going to bluff it needed to be a 3-bet AI on the flop. As played, yeah, it's spew. Your hand doesn't make any sense, and you're giving great odds for your opponent to call w/ a really wide range. I think the only thing you can hope for is he's bad and folds his AK split.

 

[Aballinamion]

Slightly surprised though that you and @Aballinamion have issues with the 4bet

What are these issues?

 

[Station_Master]

What are these issues?

You are saying not to 4bet pre

 

[Aballinamion]

You are saying not to 4bet pre

I say what I don't or won't do. But if you think that your overall 4-bet strategy works keep on doing.
I believe that players at NLHE 25 use to think more and be more aware of ranges, for this reason I would avoid it using off-suited combos.
Unless that I'm playing a very aggressive bankroll management, having over 200 buy-ins to begin with, that's what I would do.