DOJ adds Lederer/Ferguson/Furst to Complaint - Claims defrauded poker players

alaskabill

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They aren't just after Bitar and some people we've never heard about now. If the DOJ wins this Howard and Jesus will be personally liable for your money.


Its Subject poker's headline story. Its also in the Wall Street Journal.


Mods I didn't put this in BF thread because its pretty new/big.

http://www.subjectpoker.com/
 
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naruto_miu

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Ya I was about to post Similar story then I ran across yours so good thing I didn't...
 
O

onemorechance

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Hope they all see a jail cell
 
vanquish

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i wonder how safe they all feel on a day-to-day basis


like i wonder if lederer would feel safe walking down the strip alone or if he'd be in constant fear that some .5/1 grinder will bash his face in for stealing his $5k
 
naruto_miu

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vanquish said:
i wonder how safe they all feel on a day-to-day basis


like i wonder if lederer would feel safe walking down the strip alone or if he'd be in constant fear that some .5/1 grinder will bash his face in for stealing his $5k
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LOL, Damn that would be funny to hear on the News
 
dj11

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Note to jaymfc....

lose the hat......

Shave the beard, work on a swedish accent......;)
 
Charade You Are

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alaskabill said:
They aren't just after Bitar and some people we've never heard about now. If the DOJ wins this Howard and Jesus will be personally liable for your money.

http://www.subjectpoker.com/

Its Subject poker's headline story. Its also in the Wall Street Journal.

Mods I didn't put this in BF thread because its pretty new/big.
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And Forbes, and it is in the BF thread.

Forbes: http://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanva...-ponzi-scheme/

Wonder if they are doing this to deflect US players anger at them. The forbes article seems a bit weak. Not to defend FTP, but the DOJ did keep seizing the deposits players were trying to make. The DOJ has at least $115 million of our $ which would go a long way toward repaying the players.
 
PC69

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Really just disgusting to read this. I agree that they should see jail time.
 
Dorkus Malorkus

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Buying your FTP monies for 0c/$, PM me.
 
JamesDaBear

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It is very disappointing. I stuck with FTP for years even as a Washington State player at "great risk" to myself. I believed in the people who ran the company and the business model and acumen they claimed to possess. I don't really idolize poker players, but some of them significantly misrepresented the worth of the site they convinced many poker players to play and deposit money and let hold our money even in times of declining economies. For a few months now, my expectations were to be out the money I had on FTP, but now I'm at a loss for how I stand with poker in general, and how much I can trust anyone involved with the game.
 
kidkvno1

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The FTP Insider Defendants are liable to the Government for a sum of money representing the amount of property, funds, or monetary instruments involved in the money laundering offenses described above, in an amount that is no less than $40,954,781.53 for Bitar; $41,856,010.92 million for Lederer; $25 million for Ferguson; and $11,706,323.96 million for Furst.
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I don't know what to say. If they are why we can't get our money, i hope they go to jail for this. This is just wrong of them.
 
Pothole

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Just read about this in an email from EGR magazine, jail time seems fitting. Paying themselves from player funds is theft, the Alderney Gaming Commission should be liable also for allowing a company to operate this way.
 
PC69

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My opinion is very simple, disgusted dakota-xx. Its disheartening to think that the money that I've personally put on that site was intentionally stolen. Not just mine but others all over the world. These folks stole money, and possibly used it in other poker tourneys to further there fortunes. I mean it sounds far fetched, but they actually stole this money if they knew they were using players funds that were taken from the site it was intended to fund. Its also a little frustrating because alot of American players defend online poker to people everyday, who think that its all a scam. Gonna be pretty hard not to look like a idiot now when trying to explain Cereus and now FT.
 
jazzaxe

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Full Tilt owes me a lot of money. That being said, this justice department continues to astound me. The anti-online poker stance of the Gov. would be greatly enhanced by the publicity of the suit. If the boys were duped into taking the inflated salaries without knowledge of the fraud they might squeeze out of this. I hope no one misses a very important point. Does the US have jurisdiction over a foreign company operating on the internet? This may be a case of our justice department trying to enforce foreign laws against US citizens. If you are familiar with the Gibson guitar seizure. The DOJ raided their Nashville operation and seized wood which is considered to be in short supply in Asia. There was no US law or ruling showing a violation. They just did it on their own. Get used to it Americans. Administrative agencies will be making the laws and Courts and the legislative bodies will not.
 
DINGO8MYBABY

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The complaint also maintains that the aforementioned board members are liable to the government "in an amount that is no less than $40,954,781.53 for Bitar; $41,856,010.92 million for Lederer; $25 million for Ferguson; and $11,706,323.96 million for Furst."
This will effectively end these players careers. Anytime they step outside there should be a defrauded FTP player ready with a shiv.
 
Collin Moshman

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It’s a shame that Full Tilt would violate player trust, and act against their own long-term best interests, by treating player accounts as personal checking accounts. Legalization and transparency will now be more vital than ever for the future of online poker.
 
Dorkus Malorkus

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jazzaxe said:
Full Tilt owes me a lot of money. That being said, this justice department continues to astound me. The anti-online poker stance of the Gov. would be greatly enhanced by the publicity of the suit. If the boys were duped into taking the inflated salaries without knowledge of the fraud they might squeeze out of this.
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Err, they ran the company. They are named specifically by the DoJ, so the DoJ evidently has something linking them to the situation at hand - there are other shareholders who haven't been mentioned, after all. There is no way they can possibly plead ignorance (well they could try, but it wouldn't work). Despite all the hate (some justified, some not) being thrown at the DoJ for their oppressive stance towards online poker, without their interference in this case Lederer, Bitar et al could have got away with the alleged crimes indefinitely, and that is really scary.

Anyway, there is no chance that FT survives this. The damage has been done regardless of whether criminal proceedings are initiated and regardless of the results of any civil/criminal proceedings. This isn't another UB-style situation where the masses were ignorant to the scam, this will go mainstream (if it hasn't already).

Looking optimistically at the situation for a moment, this whole situation appears to me like a giant neon sign advertising regulation of online poker in the US. Hopefully the government will see it the same way.
 
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Four Dogs

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JusSumguy said:
As is should be. What was he thinking? Calling hisself Jesus. ;)



Lets see.... Pay the players, or collect penalties. Hmmmmmm.


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Exactly. As far as the DOJ is concerned, all american on-line players were engaging in an illegal activity. Don't expect them to shed any tears for us. The DOJ claims that poker stars and Full Tilt combined are liable for up to 3 Billion Dollars in fines. That $115k is just a little drop in a very big bucket.
 
LarkMarlow

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I'm stunned. What an obscene amount of money. The ramifications of this latest development have my mind reeling. My immediate reaction was one of disbelief about Chris Ferguson. I mean, this is a guy whose world exists on a theoretical plane that few of us can fathom--he even had to be taught how to show emotion when he won a televised tournament. As such, I have a hard time imagining him being involved in such a greed-based scheme. My next thought was one of utter deflation about the disastrous impact this allegation will surely have, regardless of whether it is true or not.
 
Charade You Are

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Four Dogs said:
Exactly. As far as the DOJ is concerned, all american on-line players were engaging in an illegal activity. Don't expect them to shed any tears for us. The DOJ claims that Poker Stars and Full Tilt combined are liable for up to 3 Billion Dollars in fines. That $115k is just a little drop in a very big bucket.
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Exactly. That's why I don't understand the reaction of yeah DOJ at other forums and I worry about the negative impact of stupid newscasters turning sentiment against online poker.
 
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